#1327 - Mike Baker

Jul 30, 2019

Mike Baker is a former CIA covert operations officer. Currently he is the president of Diligence LLC, a global intelligence and security firm.

Play Episode

Hello friends this episode the podcast is brought to you by the motherfucking cash app the cash app which is the number one finance app in the app store did you know well now you do it's the most powerful way for you to send spend and save and it's also linked to the cash card which is a free debit card powered by boosts money-saving boosts it's real simple you open up the cash app pick a boost like 10% off at Whole Foods or dollar off at any coffee shop and you just start saving and booster unlimited so it's like coupons you can use over and over and over again and they're always adding new ones and if you're not ready to switch debit cards you don't have to with the cash app you can instantly transfer funds to your cash card for free so when you see a boost you like you just add funds swipe and save cash apps also the easiest way for you to buy sell and deposit Bitcoin most Bitcoin exchanges

take days for a bank transfer to become investable through the cash app it takes seconds you can invest as little as $1 and and boom you own Bitcoin welcome to the club and if that wasn't sweet enough from now until the end of July which is literally today rights tomorrow the 31st we got one more day in July that's it from now to the end of July when you download the cash app from the app store or Google Play Market enter the referral code Joe Rogan all one word you get $10 not five but 10 and the cash app will also send ten dollars to support our good friend Justin Ren's fight for the Forgotten charity which is building Wells for the pygmies in the Congo it's a win-win we're also brought to you by LegalZoom we are in the middle of summer ladies and gentlemen the last thing you're thinking about right now is completing your last will or living trust but it's actually a perfect time to do it because it's National make a will month at legalzoom.com

for over 18 years LegalZoom has developed a straightforward way for you to protect what you care about the most your family and assets and it starts with the last will or living trust estate plan if it sounds confusing don't worry because LegalZoom has a ton of online resources for you to figure out what's right for you and if that's not enough their network of independent attorneys can provide advice if you need more Direction and LegalZoom isn't a law firm so you will not be billed by the hour so join over 1 million people that have counted on LegalZoom for a will or living trust before another summer passes by go to legalzoom.com during National make a will month and enter the code Rogan at checkout for special savings that's legalzoom.com were life meets legal and we're also brought to you by movement movement watches and sunglasses to they have a bunch of cool shit well you shouldn't have to choose between overpriced designer sunglasses and

Shades that won't last you this summer right that's why movement and VMT watches and sunglasses is your solution now I've talked about their watches I'm actually wearing one right now I have this I love this little watch it's got a silicone black band and a black face with it's very minimalist and all their stuff is like that they have beautiful watches and also beautiful sunglasses they have hundreds of Premium affordable sunglass styles to choose from so whether you're into Timeless shapes like classic round Sonny's or something that makes a statement like fun 90s skinny frames they've got them all they're constructed with durable acetate and lightweight materials for a perfect reliable fit and they just fucking look great and you have to pay a shitload to get it and they also have free shipping and returns so you could try out as many styles as you want right from your home

so what they've done is they've eliminated the middle person the minimum I would say middleman but I'm not sexist they haven't eliminated the retail aspect of the that's why things cost so much you got to pay for a brick and mortar store you got to pay for electricity and all that jazz they don't have that all their Styles come with polarized lens option so if you're a Fisher person you like fishing well it helps you to look in the water you can see Fish better and it's great for Harsh summer light M VM T sunglasses start at $60 and no pair prices over $95 and I'm talking these are dope fucking sunglasses they've sold over 2.5 million products across more than 160 countries and their collections are always expanding get 15% off today with free shipping and free returns by going to MVM t.com Rogan and Cy movement keeps growing check out their expanding collection go to m v

Mt.com / Rogan and join the movement all right my guest today is he's been on the podcast the podcast what is it called again he's been on the podcast many times before his name is Mike Baker he is an American British former covert operations officer with the Central Intelligence Agency and I was like checking in on him and seeing what the fuck is going on in the world and what I need to really be worried about and he provides data and he's a great guy so please give it up for my friend Mike Baker

The Joe Rogan Experience trained by day Joe Rogan podcast by night all day let's crack it's good to be back good to be back good luck it's always amazing it's like it's a it's like a little it's a bit of an amusement park almost now yeah with stuff to see and the gym equipment and everything I keep thinking I should just bring my gear over and work out before the show or after the show but get loose I don't want to embarrass myself so I'm gonna embarrass yourself I'm not gonna watch gonna watch you work out he would Jamie's I kind of got yeah I just seen him give me side eye he would give you side eye but don't think it's yeah it's all good everything's everything's good I've been traveling a lot haven't we just talked before we started about Idaho haven't had a chance to get back there but yeah all good all good so you're around for a television show is that what you're doing yeah this is this is there's a several meetings going on here but we just finished filming a show reality show for

say the network I'm the kind of hinky on until we get closer to the air date which is October but it's for the discovery Network and it's going to be it's going to be a great show that I hosted want you to say the name well you know what that's what I always said I wish that free publicity it's a good thing but they're very tight on the marketing protocols and so they want to make sure they've got it all buttoned up and I get that right they spend you know a lot of money on these things and fucking so freaks yes yeah and so anyway it's but it's going to be a great great show we spent the past three or four months filming it around the country really good production team and the stories are fantastic it's basically looking at I guess I'm talking about it I'm not supposed to but that we're looking at military government organizations that are typically in the shadows right we're not releasing any sources and methods for not disclosing classified Secrets we're talking about elements and units operational activity events that before now I've pretty much been

in the shadows and some incredible people that's one of the best parts about this thing has been going out there and meeting some of these guys that are doing some of this high-speed shit and it's pretty amazing and when they do release things like long long after I was reading something I forget what the case was about but it was something about how the files won't be released under the Freedom of Information Act until 2080 hmm well how do you yeah I know what are the hell they make that distinct like that was the thing with the Kennedy assassination right and sometimes they roll it over and it's not even that right so sometimes they extend that other times they don't and and so some information comes to light periodically and so this does look at this this show will be looking at some historic but a lot of current things that are going on and where the money goes right what are we spending our money on when it comes to this high-speed operations at the special forces and others are involved in so it'll be it'll be very good I was I was lucky to be able to work with again you know some really great people on the production side

but just also going out there and meeting some of these cats that have just the the shit that they do is it's even after being around a while so I have it just amazes me well it's gotta be constantly accelerating to the right there's they're constantly coming up with new and spectacular things that nobody knows about yeah till they employ them right excited sometimes that that shit stays on the shelf right you know you it was like the running joke at the agency at the CIA was you know they we have a fantastic S&T group of Science and Technology and then the ones responsible like you from from Bondi the other ones responsible for developing all the gear responding to specific operational requirements how we're going to do this particular thing well it's develop a piece of Kit that's going to allow us to do it but the running joke is always a you know they'll develop it and I'll show it to you before it operation but then I'll put it back on the Shelf because they don't want that shit getting out there right and people finding out that they've got it so they'll give you like a 20 year old piece of Kit to use instead and you'll be walking around with like a phone the size of a brick

knowing that they've got something high speed on the Shelf well that's what everybody always thinks like when you talk to the average Joe on the street about technology and the government there was like dude stuff they have they probably don't tell us about how much of that is real yeah it's it's pretty real have you seen some stuff that made you go holy shit yeah they can do that yes really yeah and how much can you tell us well you know what one thing that they're doing and there's this is actually something I wanted to talk about today because it's going to affect everybody it's not just something that it's going to affect people in the military or else in the intelligence Community but one of the things that they've been working on is Imagine you've got it you got to rock up on it on a Target and your butt your before you do that before you get the customers on site and you're going to you know hopefully obtain some high-value targets there at that location before you do it you got it you talking like euphemisms oh I'm sorry for you look people yeah before you before you go in there low tariffs into another dimension

but sometimes you know you better okay actually I was gonna say sometimes you want to actually capture them and get their intelligence we've gone past that right because the years where we were getting our ass kicked for holding onto people in detention facilities you know what that did that that pretty much convinced everybody that was involved in this to just just whack them right because then you don't have to deal with the aftermath you don't have to worry about are you going to get in trouble for interrogation helping right exactly so so that actually increased lethality of operation she started painting targets and just blowing the shit out of there rather than trying to grab the Target and get their Intel that's a problem because in the pipeline dries up for the Intel but anyway so imagine you got this you got this site first thing you got to do is determine if your targets they're right and it's not like that you know the Tom Clancy movies where you know you're looking through walls and all this shit it's you know that that technology night vision devices and and that ability and low light conditions to to Monitor and to identify specific individuals

has always been a problem they make great strides on it to the point now where in no light conditions right with the with the right stack database with the right information and I database meaning the right amount of information about individuals right you just you constantly populating this database with new faces or with new photographs of individuals that you're going after with enough of that to sift through they're getting to the point now with no light conditions that they can identify positively The Targets in that room of The Targets in that facility or in that building whatever it might be and that's pretty incredible I rather they can identify people by their heart rate mmm with well not just their heart right but I mean other other bio-data right I mean other but they can literally with video somehow or another they can zoom in on you with some scanner and recognize that this is a particular individual because their heart rate yeah this is there was an article that was written about it and I know that

that there's a company do you know what hex is hecs it's a company that's been used pretty extensively by scuba diving community and now by The Hunting Community as well because it blocks the electrical signal hecs it blocks the electrical signal that your body gives off okay yeah that makes sense and I think they're doing work with the military as well to develop suits that will somehow another stop someone from being able to recognize your particular heart rate right and it does a lot of work on what they call a sort of the universe there soldier pentagon is a Lay's that I got identify people from a distance by the other happy yeah it helps loser it helps if you have other data points right if you had a but this is all part of it to some degree what you know they refer to as the universal Soldier right that the fighter of tomorrow and I'm Claude Van Damme yeah but they ain't got shit that's right I'm that yeah

doesn't remember genre although he's always wandering he's doing like chip commercials now sure you haven't seen him time to grow nose or whatever dude 70 is triple the splits yeah props yeah I don't know when that becomes useful oh really it's the splits I mean I've never actually you know felt that that was something I needed to accomplish in any given moment from an operational in karate movies where you have to do this one it's so very important but so the universal Soldier thing where you you you're you know the its exoskeleton it's the soft suit it's all the data that you can acquire for that war fighter how do you create the perfect environment on that individual as he's moving through an environment to to you know be a more efficient effective lethal fighter and you know things like that identifying Target whether it's with a laser whether it's with low light or no light conditions where you can as you're rocking up on the target you can do that all these things you know the ability to carry more

you're right hump it another extra you know ten kilometers whatever it might be it's pretty incredible what they're doing and it's a joint it's not just the military they're working with you know companies like hex or they're working with with the commercial sector and academics to but anyway and I Disappeared down a rabbit hole these like the idea of like this universal Soldier thing if you've been paying attention to this Elon Musk neural link thing that he's coming out with with they're going to somehow or another insert fibers into your brain and then have a Bluetooth enabled device that you where that's going to allow you to somehow or another interface with data at a much higher bandwidth I don't know what the fuck any of those words mean I just said but that was good though it was good it sounded like him you understood it that's my trick so repeat words yeah I you know there comes a point if you're talking about I mean that's that's going into a different area that's going into civilian applications and

but wait military application would be great for that to everyone could synchronize data you could give them navigation in their head like if there's some sort of augmented reality we could literally see The Targets in front of you like the if you had a map say like the Pentagon really does have this laser beam they could identify specific individuals and you have a map of a building that's in your head and they can identify the very location absolute perfect location of each individual person in that room and you could see that as you're running into this building you're seeing like a 3D Grid in front of you and you know what I mean you could shoot him right through a fucking wall right and there's but there does become a problem then it becomes a problem of information overload and when you get into that situation right everything starts to close down a little bit right and and or and so you've got to start pushing some of that away and and now what you end up doing is you get the off-site you know Command Center relaying some of that information as needed but that guy that's about to

each that door you know he doesn't want write a lot of data points anymore now having said that knowing where you know knowing where the hostiles are in the other side of that door that is key information that's not rocket science but so there but there's a lot that's going on is also the ability to monitor the health of the individual you know soldiers they're out there through the the gear that they would then be wearing it's an it's an incredible effort that has been going on and so to answer your point a long rambling answer yeah I've seen some things that are pretty amazing you can't talk about though no no some of this some of this should actually will get into with the new show that's coming up sometime in Fall I don't have a release date and again I prescribed from talking about so I won't do that because so some of the attention some of the things that you saw you'll be able to talk about yes so how does the government do that they just decide well Wilson it's not a bad thing if you tell people about this somebody that's right yeah I mean well I think there's there's an element of some of it's not what you would refer to as classified it's just not readily available public information and

not out there in the domain because people aren't aware of it are searching for it some of it does I think you're right some of it is look the military wants to say at times look what we're able to do but doing this and oftentimes it's because it's in a sort of a private public cooperation and so that encourages other companies with Innovative Technologies to step forward and get involved in some of this and I guess that opens up all sorts of other you know some people are out there saying well they shouldn't be working with the military well fuck well that's a question that I had that this is brings me to a point that I think is kind of important where people always talk about the military budget and how high the military budget is and you know we need to take some of that money and put it in other places and you know maybe some of that military money is not being used to the best for the best good of the human race or maybe maybe some of it but in order to be able to develop stuff that keeps people safer in order to develop

all the stuff that you're talking about that could potentially save the lives of soldiers and even innocent civilians because you're going to be able to Target the correct people like all this stuff seems pretty critical right right and it's also there is a it was an upside if you want to get you know moralistic about the whole thing to developing advanced technology sent you can be more surgical right that the Drone capability is an example gives you a much better understanding of your target you can avoid the collateral damage you know the deaths of civilians on site through the use of proper technology and that creates that environment and so it's a good thing and again I mean CIA their S&T group over the years the shit that they've developed for operational purposes that then made its way into the commercial sector and Planet fitted people what Battery Technology anybody walking around with a pacemaker or defibrillator you know in part can thank the the agency because what were they doing they were they were working they continue to work on battery

technology shrinking those batteries as a power source what initially operational purposes so you could you know put a transmitter out some site you know and you know so what do you do when you're eavesdropping on a hostile Target or you know Gathering intelligence but then that that effort all that work that was done then that later on benefits the general public a drone technology same thing right I mean the agency was front and center on developing drone capability now what do you do when you're doing that to you know for environmental concerns you know for mining it's so it's I'm a little concerned about drone technology my old house that I used to live at this motherfucker that lived down the street from H2 a:hover a drone over my house and film it like like I know he's like looking at me like what are you doing to ask me swimming you fucking weirdo did you ever go over and talk to him no no should have some drone over his house yeah I was thinking of shooting it down but it's hard to aim up now

can now add a bow and arrow yeah like that'll be a hell of a shot you have a good boat like see the way the way you calculate accuracy with archery is you have a range finder and that range finder has a built-in adjustments for angle this angle compensation for up or for down but I don't know if it has a four straight up in the air like because you got to think the way you you're judging how much an arrows going to drop over the course of the flight right right right it seems the bonds to yeah right but with a bullet obviously this last competition because it's pretty much faster but there's a video that's hilarious of this guy got tired of this block party in Brazil so he loaded up a drone filled with fireworks and he hovered it over the block party and started launching bottle rockets down on these guys that are make it too much noise that's excellent though I mean if you think that sounds like something one of my

as would do right and I'm sure they'll be listening to this at some point so that I'm did they take are going to do this yet scooter Sluggo and Mugsy butts when your true name Sluggo or Mugsy or scooter guarantee they're going to do so they're gonna do something like that yeah yeah it's you know is that when you're naming your kid I didn't know no it didn't occur to me it didn't occur to me although I wanted to give you a gene or something I want to get Eugene Eugene I wanted to give him flat tops right every summer I want to have the same discussion with with with my wife who's the world's greatest person I wanted to give them flat tops and she always says look with names like scooter Slugger Mugsy you give them a flat top as well then that's it yeah on a database exactly they're going somewhere but it's you know the best way to take down a drone is is just blanket it jam it and drop it up well you'd it's like you know it's like the old days of jamming a radio signal basically right when you're interrupting your blanketing and you're interrupting the the data communication from the controller right to the Drone and like the Drone that was

calm down in the Iranian drone that we took down the I think it's the USS boxer was involved in that out there in the the the straight that's how they do it they don't fire a missile at it anymore you know it's just it's much more effective something added to disrupt the signal right yeah it's essentially again not oversimplifies just jamming but is that jamming technology available to civilians to really really smart civilians I guess it could it could be a really smart civilians would probably be able to figure that stuff out Jamie yeah I know anybody that's work on that yeah Jamie so yeah screw drone technology scooter was just out at West Point he wants to go to West Point when he's when he's old enough and so he went out there for lacrosse program and I'd forgotten have you been to West Point no you got you got to go it's um it's I know it's a ways away from here it's not a day trip but it's this it's a beautiful campus and I forgot about that obviously it's got a that were Jodie Foster was

Silence of the Lambs militia West Point it didn't sound right I don't think so the Drone kill gun wow that's crazy three the lightweight compact drone countermeasure there was a drone gun 3000 Jamie order me one of those immediately Amazon please yeah that wouldn't that would have taken that would have taken care of this guy yeah but the problem is it's not as satisfying as a bow and arrow yes that's a good point that's a good point so one of the things I wanted I don't know how we end it's not a smooth segue but we were talking about bit about technology technology is particular with the 2020 election coming up is this idea of deep fakes yeah tastic stuff and the technology to create this nowadays to create a deep fake updated which essentially just means your doctoring a photo or video and

can it do what you want to do to try to convince people of whatever it is technology is advancing and it's stunning what you know done Kyle Dunnigan is Kyle Dunnigan I should know I should know hilarious stand-up comedian but he shines in doing deep fakes and he's working with this other guy think the guys called dr. fake enstein or the fake inning so that they can yeah yeah one of those guys but it go to go to his Instagram and see the new one that he did with Elon Musk he was doing them really kind of crudely with like faced with you know face swap or face yeah it's like a little filter that you get from Snapchat or something like that or Instagram but now he's moved from that to doing this really high-end stuff go to the Elon Musk one look at this play this after faking standard this yeah okay so Labs which is pretty cool it's pretty cool but but we had a little snafu and it looks like time is slowing down and will eventually start going backwards at an increasing rate so

pretty soon you will become a baby again and be sucked back into your mother's vagina of God okay now pause now go to another Kyle Dunnigan video so he can tell what Kyle really looks like that's him to the right of that this is what he really looks like which is fucking Madness yeah

the guy's hilarious by the way he's awesome guy to and he's got a great Instagram page but his Instagram page is mostly him like the gold bonus so the gold will - chick click on that because that's a normal one this is what he did with the filters without dr. Finkelstein look at the see how it's kind of creepy face yeah yeah but play that so Ellen DeGeneres so our asses seems friendly but but but the don't get too close to her she'll bite your fucking head off just ask the Porsche Raptor yes yes yes yes yes and as Ray Liotta great Ray Liotta's always smoking yeah although we gave it off but in the videos he's always fucking this but look it's it's bad enough that it's extra hilarious because it's bad but the new one that he did with Elon Musk is not bad it's not bad like Caitlyn Jenner one go to that Caitlyn Jenner one of the far right that's fucking genius click on this one

carefully Kylie I have something serious to tell you yeah when you had your surgery years ago I buried your old face in a pet cemetery by accident and I'm sorry to say it's back yum yum but those those are my favorites he has the car - is the only thing that's the only way they talk they just say yum yum and then he knows what they're saying sort of like Groot in Guardians of the Galaxy I don't know how I missed these things I well watching the wrong shit on the internet well you're a former CIA guy should know that you're doing important thing enough time for Kyle Dunnigan well but this but what you just showed I mean people look at that and I go okay and that but that you write the deal on Mustang is getting closer to creepy that would be a real guy but you can have someone like that say give me a million dollars or I'll blow your house up or just come on yeah and imagine if he gave

you know some off-the-cuff financial data on Tesla not talk about it as if he just came out of a shareholder call and now he was releasing some information I mean think about what that means to the all of a sudden the stock price of a company of yes that happens but the quality is so far beyond even that now that can be done by and we're talking mostly State actors like Russia and so the problem we're facing now is it's not just everybody's kind of kind of aware of you know the the sort of the Tweeter verse or whatever the Twitter and the trolls that exists on there and the Bots and all of that but it's the video the ability to do the video they released one one was done not too long ago with Nancy Pelosi and it all it did was slow down her speech Just slightly but just enough to make it sound as if she was slurring her words maybe she'd a couple of drinks and that thing was blasted all over social media and people to this day still think and they still talk about it like you know she's kind of losing it a little bit and write and

that like or more by the way if she did that yeah I think it'll make a little more sense get a little lighten up lady yeah worth a hundred million dollars and no one knows why you should have be out there partying I'm sure it was all oh so legit yeah she earned that hundred million dollars hmm sure there's definitely no Shenanigans no legal Shenanigans no there's nothing like that happening up on Capitol Hill but it's so this this is a it's something that people should watch it something that people should you know read up on a little bit look at it because the technology is advancing so quickly that the effort to combat at the effort to detect it and there's some companies out there and certainly the government is working to do that DARPA and some others are working but the effort to try to identify doctored videos right particularly when you're talking about elections campaigns is is it's going to be an increasing problem that we're not really discussing that much Congress is paying a little bit of attention to it right now

but it's it's really problematic and there's things that that you used to be able to look for right lighting and and noise and just sort of the movements of the face what they call Micro heartbeats and and all the little things is the subject in the video blinking for instance when your doctor it sometimes they the blinking wouldn't be there and that was a tell but the the people involved in all of this and creating these deep fakes are working you know at such a pace that they're getting ahead of that so it's I mean it's fascinating so anyway they're coming up with ways to try to counter it but I guess the biggest point is it sounds like a public service announcement is people need to be aware of it and they need to be smart about course they won't be everybody goes to the internet and they lose their minds and they believe whatever it is that they read that agrees with their opinion sure and there's no bothering of it checking you know whether anything is actually legit anymore not

but if that would be my one piece of advice going into 2020 starting now pay attention don't believe anything you see until you prove it and that's part of the problem to write C now if I was believing anything we see right but if I was a skeptical person right if I was a conspiracy minded individual I'd say you know this guy who used to work for the CIA is telling us not to believe the news wait I see what you're saying what I'm saying is yes setting us up okay well it's time for me to go look at that right wouldn't ya normal skeptical person want to thank like why is he telling us that I guess I guess I'm saying I'm saying it wrong because you're right I don't mean to say I don't mean to imply I guess what I'm saying is trust but verify right when you're looking at video of a candidate or you're looking at anything really on the internet now just be aware of the capabilities maybe that's a better way of putting all of this because you're right you don't want it part of the problem and one of the things that Russia does and others who are involved in this whole propaganda effort

one of the things they do want to do is undermine our confidence obviously and media so you know by me saying don't believe what you see I'm kind of feeding into that so you're right I shouldn't I shouldn't go that route be aware of what the capabilities are pay attention everybody should just be a little bit smarter but what they're doing that's all I'm saying so and also what we're looking at now is so much more powerful than what we had three or four years ago we three or four years ago this technology was not available for the consumer but now it is well there was I mean you think about it if not to get too deep but if you think about the photography how long is photography been around there have been efforts to manipulate photography right so these so altering photographs has been around almost as long as the the medium itself go to photoshop that kind of put it all in the hands of the consumer you know what you were talking about face swap the new face app to age people

yeah all these things make it easier for whoever's got a smartphone to try to do this but what you really and that's a problem as well but one of the things that you really have to worry about is again sort of the state actors like a Russia I mean Russia was behind the faces Swamp Thing well yeah and that's good for sap the right there are Russian companies that are pushing this technology out there and what are they doing you know you every time you do that it's recording data about you well not only that you have to give your name and your email to get that application and then they have a photo of your face that correlates with your name and your email so what they've done is they've gathered up more than a hundred and fifty million emails and faces and they have data on people yeah that is that's pretty powerful stuff like if you think about what Facebook is done right what Facebook is made billions and billions of dollars by essentially mining data right that's what they're about Google's the same thing they're mining data well Russia managed to do that

the hundred fifty million people in a very very short amount of time just by making something cute oh let's see what I look like when I'm a hundred man now what do you think they're doing with that data they're slicing and dicing this trying to understand the American electorate yeah they're good they're not going to stop doing what they did and they've been doing this forever we talked about this before they've been doing this since 1940 s right busy trying to keep the u.s. out of World War Two before they broke up with the Nazis so it was a it was a serious breakup but when they were still aligned they were busy paying off journalists and buy and trade unions and all the rest of it so they're not they're never going to stop what they do because it's worked for them and it's just kind of in their DNA white but it's not also what the United States does as well there's got to be some sort of counterintelligence stuff that we do that is sort of shading she well I don't know about Shady but yeah yeah justifiably Shady how about that yeah I like that okay that's a good term yeah of course there is and people always do that people are you know when I want to talkin about if I'm giving a talk about Chinese government's constant theft

intellectual property and somebody inevitably will come up afterwards and they will kind of roll their eyes and go well we do it it's not like it's just them the u.s. is guilty of it too what you damn well better hope we are right because if we backed off and said you know what just you know for the sake of being a righteous individual we're not going to do any of this shit you would have to be with willfully ignorant and naive or just fucking stupid to think that Russia China these other actors out there are going to stop also and walking to hold hands and unicorns going to flying out of our ass it's not going to happen so yeah I mean I guess the answer to that is always the same which is yeah you better hope we do it and we better hope we do it well yeah but people are nervous about that right like this is my point about the military budget like if you just cut the military entirely well we're all going to start speaking Chinese because some shits gonna go down like you can't just cut the military budget you just you can't I mean just cut it out one no no military at all we're going to focus on ourselves yeah good fucking luck with that that doesn't work so the

his like how much money should you spend on the military how much money should you spend on counterintelligence how much money should you spend on propaganda I mean there should be some money spent on propaganda overseas right right as we're trying to manipulate them the way they're trying to manipulate us the idea though is that where America where nice we're the good guys we're doing it the right way supposedly yeah well there where is that right there is that and there's and you know what honestly I'll be honest with you I I've always liked maybe I'm naive or whatever but that was always my thought process you know we're out there in the operational world you think you know what okay it's doing this but we're doing it for the right reason and people laugh at that I whatever but you know this is my phone so you can look at that see that flag that like a wave that's how I when I open up my phone the flag waves at me I got a flag behind me I'm a hundred percent pro-america I got my phone we like the throne I got I got I got nothing I got nothing I got I got an old phone to that's some sort of like hack free yeah

on from the 60s actually wind up phone it's a surprise yourself with phone yeah I don't have a flip the government yeah and you know what else I've got a I've got a collection of phone's going all the way back to the the cinderblock phone remember that when I bet you that's fantastic Saudi Arabian numbers on them and shit and letters I assumed everybody does but yeah that is I think this is you phones that like are like hack-proof I tell you this phone so you can't use well yeah you certainly know that you know from an operational perspective you know phones are not a good idea now the problem is they're ubiquitous and everybody uses them and it you know it's made life very easy well I know it's also made life a little bit less secure obviously I know a guy that is a let's just say done some very unusual journalism and he still has a phone you can take the batteries out he said there's some places where you go where they will

let you in the room if you have a phone and so thus the workaround is he has an older Samsung phone we could pop the back off and remove the battery and that's the only way yeah I mean that's you know I I would still argue there's there's workarounds on that one so yeah but yeah he like when you when you go into a government facility you know they all had asked if you know you got to leave your phones outside and a leadbox right right so you don't you don't care your phones in you know unless you're what was her name that was doing that walking into all the fucking chick from The Apprentice yeah that's Omarosa that's how hilarious is that by the way I know her I did Fear Factor with her yeah okay she was on fear fact she told me I was drunk because I was making fun of her it's like you're drunk like not much I'm just making fun of you yeah why wouldn't you but she's a she's a unusual person the fact that she thought it was okay to do what is a basically treasonous she was recording

these conversations inside the White House and then releasing them to the Press how is she not in jail how does that work yeah I'm not quite sure I didn't quite understand how you how you get around that right because you've got obligations you signed paperwork you do all these things and say I'm going to do the right thing and if you run foul of that then you're supposed to suffer the consequences and occasionally it seems like people aren't I had against want to know what I think what I think she saw some shit they pulled her aside and said listen I'm around so I know that you're some sort of a social climber whatever you're trying to do here but listen what you did will literally get you locked in jail for the rest of your life so how about this how about you just shut your pie hole and we'll just let this slide yeah I don't know that she's I don't think anybody would I mean from account intelligence perspective she'd be one of the last people you would trust to actually keep her mouth shut up already period of time so yeah it's that's a tough one but that was that's it that's also part of the the issue of

of leaks as an example right I mean the issue of choices that you make for your cabin as well right well that's true yeah yeah wait to see those good the closed circle around you and that's you know again you can argue I mean we don't want to get into a political discussion Trump is an unusual character and you know they certainly they've been yeah I know well well that's going to be that that'll be headlines how about that fellow that's from England that looks like the boys - yeah the British Trump I was just there last week when when he went over to Buckingham Palace and you know was asked by the queen of form the new government and accepted and you know he's an interesting character he went to eat and he went to Oxford he's he's proven himself to be extremely Adept at getting getting elected and most importantly he looks like Trump's baby brother yeah yeah you know what I think is fucked up really like Trump's dad went over to England and bang some waitress and Bam next thing you know look at the two of them together get the fuck out of here this is my business

buddy of mine sent me this one it's a South Park one hits him with a bike helmet on it's that's the best side by side I've seen this one better this one's better oh yeah I mean it literally looks like a young Trump cousin or brother or something like but he's promised you know he's promised their their out as far as brexit goes by you know Halloween by 31 October they're done and so they're done with the whole European Union yeah well that's what that's what they're saying I'm basically now that what they're concerned about of course is it's a hard hard exit right no deal but he's saying it doesn't matter if that's the case then that's what we've got to do and there's a lot of people it's interesting the dynamic is a little bit like here in the US right if you're in the Northeast Corridor Washington New York whatever Boston or you're out here on the West Coast and you you tend to view the world differently than everything else the rest of the mass of the country right which is why people lost their minds and they thought you know how could Trump possibly get elected

the UK is a little bit like that that brexit vote came around and everybody in London was convinced that we're you know it's gonna be 95% you know we're not leaving and so when it came time and they devoted to leave in 2001 I was 16 the people in London lost their minds they couldn't believe it and they still to this day think everybody else is just an idiot right so there's a similarity say which is I think why in part Trump you know feels sort of that this kinship with Boris Johnson but yeah so he's Boris Johnson has said that's it we're out of here you know maybe we can get a deal if we can't doesn't matter we're still leaving and it'll be interesting to see what happens but you know he's not he's not unpopular what's the argument for them leaving what's the pro brexit argument do you really want to have your country your Sovereign Nation run by a bunch of faceless technocrats living in Brussels who have really zero interest in your Sovereign Nation right that's at the heart of it it's not an economic decision people always make that problem

brexit they always say well from an economic perspective this is not a good thing well the deal at heart isn't an economic concern it's it's the issue of sovereignty issue of being run again by Brussels and and sort of the position morass of of regulations that they've imposed the inability for the UK to make their own decisions about trade and so there's a you know there's a good argument in that regard is it going to be a financial problem for them it's not going to be a disaster like some people you know throw out there and say oh my God this is going to the UK is going down the toilet fast that won't happen but it'll be they'll be an upheaval if they if they you know leave without a deal but they'll adjust because everybody know people want to do deals right they want to do trade it's not like Germany and France which are the only two partners in the EU that really matter from you know how dare you yeah I know I can't believe I just so what's the what's the staying in the European Union argument show everybody not racist

yeah Global globalism you know it's we're all working together and isn't this a wonderful thing and look at you know all the benefits of it free movement and that free movement you know didn't really work that well from from France and Germany is perspective you know they don't like to talk about that anymore from Lumen is basically what we enjoy in the United States though isn't it I mean if you look at the United States relative size in comparison to Europe we're basically commensurate right yeah in terms of the contiguous United States exact size of it yeah yeah and then we all speak the same language but I'm talking about I'm talking about immigration policies I'm not talking about it within the EU don't know I understand but I mean even in Immigration right like the size of these countries in comparison to the size of States like Texas is basically bigger than a lot of fucking right European nations right yeah it's it is

that argument sort of the immigration argument much like some of the other arguments comes down from the UK's perspective on don't tell us what to do right and you know maybe there's still an element of look we you know we were an Empire that control most of the planet for a while you know we'd like to you know have a little bit more say in what we're doing so there's an independent streak the problem is from we use perspective is if they do leave and it's not a disaster then you all the countries are going to line up right and and Italy maybe would be the next one so it'll be interesting to see what happens but yeah Bojo is they call them is an interesting cat not unlike our president well it's in this country we don't pay attention to other countries so we see that we see that guy like who's that guy this new guy it's what where do you come from like is this real it's like a new character on a show that you don't watch right you know what season did he come in Better Call Saul season for like who the fuck is that guy oh that's the new bad guy I didn't watch I have been watching I just finished it

watching I do that and instead of watching new shows I end up re-watching shows that I really liked and I watched before and it's been a while so I rewatched the first season of Breaking Bad again God damn it gunshot holy shit that was goddamn so well done yeah and that just that first season of that's all people watching they haven't seen it before it's so good yeah but yeah and then I just I just binge watch the first season of The Sopranos again that's a great show that was the first show that really in my mind it created the first real antihero that everybody actually appreciated on television like everybody loved Tony Soprano he's a fucking murderer constantly cheated on his wife strangle his best friend he's like I'd like them yeah he's like he's an interesting cat yeah well it was that Dynamic with his mother right and that was that's what the hook was and that certainly that first season was just that that was fascinating to people and still you know still is speaking of deep fakes remember when they tried to bring them on back after she died like the shitty CGI yeah that's that's what shows you like 2005 CGI was goddamn terrible yeah well if you think about when photos

up Photoshop was out in what the early 90s I guess ladies early 90s think about where we've come since then not again not to go back into the sort of the this whole thing with deep fakes but it is when people talk about Russia collusion and they talked about we kind of lost our way right and you know everybody's kind of guilty of it whether it smaller and has investigated team whether it's Congress or whether it's just the general public we all kind of lost a way over the past couple of years imagining somehow that the big story here was Trump's collusion well that was a political Dodge right that was a shell game that was being played on us it was the big story is what did Russia specifically do right what exactly did they do how do they do it how successful were they show us some case studies of specific examples that's what an investigative team should have been doing for two years and then deliver that information and keep

own it out at the public and keep talking to the public about it I guarantee you they're the the Gru and and others the FSU at the in the Intel services in the in Russia they're happy that we didn't do that right because again they been advancing they've been improving their capabilities they're going to do it again so I guess that's why I keep beating on this is that I don't think we really focused our attention to where we needed to because we all get lost in this political bullshit and wife if I feel like this is the most easily manipulated we've ever been as a as a culture like I think it's so easy to spin these narratives and to get people upset about anything right and there I think I feel like a lot of these are test cases like they're trying to see like what happens when we spin up this story how how outraged do they get it that story like well look at and look at this look at the issue of racism look at look at it I mean that thing gets thrown out there now to the point where it's you know you hate to say it but it's almost losing its meaning in a sense

they just keep hammering away and it anybody they disagree with and I'm talking about the the hard left of progressives you're a racist right it's not possible you could possibly disagree on policy like that whatever that's a squad you know AOC and her Compadres I don't give a shit about you know where they're from I care about the fact that their policies from my perspective of other people I'm sure love them you know I screwed up and what's great about their policies well I'm not a Democratic Socialist right so I have a problem with everything from you look at the green new deal right and this idea that we're going to roll this out and fuck the economic impact we know or I don't necessarily think about the economic impact I think what they're doing is they're just they're playing to their a base and they're doing it successfully and people hear about it nobody wants to be righteous everybody wants to think sure if I got care about the environment yeah it's get rid of admissions that'll be a great idea

and whether it's that or open borders and the idea that somehow we're you know do I think we're running concentration camps down south no I don't think that's fucked up that we would that's the terminology that we would have right for detainment for entertainment centers and you know what you want to you want to make it better will great let's let's actually do what your job is let's make some changes to the to the to the immigration rules and to Asylum laws let's put some more money down there and make conditions a little bit better this things that we could in terms of concrete steps but we don't we don't seem to want to do that we seem to want to just throw shit around at each other and and I but the open border saying is is worrisome these are there's a guy named John Norris who was just on my friend Steve Bernal is podcast it's called the mediator podcast and he's a warden he's a game warden and one of the things that they had to deal

somewhere along the line was they had to become enforcers for illegal drug to drug marijuana growing these establishments in public lands in National Parks so these guys that were supposed to be just catching people with too many trout on the Stringer are now being forced to stop illegal grow Ops and it's all cartel members and what he's saying is that 80 to 90% of all of the marijuana that gets sold illegally in this country and the Midwest and all these different places where it's illegal is coming out of these grow-ops and a lot of it is Tainted with dangerous pesticides because these guys are trying to they're actually using poisons to keep animals from eating the marijuana so these kids that are Barda don't have the fuck is buying it they're buying this pot from these illegal places no one's testing this stuff you don't know what the fuck you're getting and you very well but could be smoking pot that's poisoning you yeah there's a guy that I know really good guys is a huge landowner

here in California to the point where you can spend all day on an ATV and still not you know get to the end of one of his plots of land and if you call it a plot of land and anyway he's had those incidents rights had where they it's such a massive piece of property that a small element from a cartel will set up a grow spot there and you know they'll camouflage and it's very well done yeah they bring in the piping for the water because it would pot uses a huge amount of water this guy was talking about water that they brought in they had a pipe that went for three miles yeah these gets carried it on their back yeah that's what they that's what these guys do and then and then eventually you know you got to go in there and bust it up but it's people that stumble across it that you know they're just out there doing their regular ranching job and it's it is fascinating I like I I feel like we should take those guys and reprogram them you get a guy who's willing to carry a hundred pounds of piping on its back and walk eight miles into the Backwoods

that's a fucking industrious individual you gotta you gotta lure them away for the cartel with a better deal yeah that guy work for a competing Corporation he'd be like look I like the way you do business right give me a job on the ranch give me yeah I found this guy and he's working for Verizon they'd be like hey come on over here man you fucking put in the time these guys are about three miles of hose on his back that's work that's what we call world work yeah so use that use your power for good not evil that's what I tell my boys it's hard though because evils fun I think it's way within the short term it could be more lucrative yeah from their perspective there is that and they have a record and probably murderer well reasons all right so maybe we're not talking about someone you going to hire as a landscaper their your home but but your point is open borders you're not a good idea of abortion not a good idea there's a lot of bad people that are getting in already and it's not it's not a stretch this is not everybody imagines is to be a stretcher or it's going to take offense at this every nation maintains borders

Every Nation maintain some element of immigration controls and and borders protection the idea that we shouldn't have that we should somehow feel exceptionally bad about it is is I don't quite understand that mentality we should feel bad when we see someone who's just a poor mother who's trying to come over to America to get a better job because she's stuck in Guatemala and it sucks over there and there's no opportunity whatsoever for her to excel right that's a different animal than someone who is a member of some fucking terrible cartel gang that comes over the question is how do we differentiate and how do we make it so that that woman who's a mom can come over here right how do we make it so it's legal that's the real question so that's when I was sure that but that's not what their address right you know how many decades now have we heard about immigration controls and immigration process and regulations and policy and then nothing ever gets done and so maybe and again I think one of the things that's interesting about Trump

is as strange as it is the environment I mean maybe the fact that he is disruptive and sometimes doesn't seem to give a shit maybe that's a good thing because it gets us talking and gets us talking in areas that we haven't before and in ways that we haven't before so maybe that results in something maybe like the Chinese the public just going to wait for him to go and then it will get back to business as usual that may happen even business as usual the concern is like if how do you differentiate between someone who's coming in illegally because they want a better life versus someone who's coming in illegally because they're literally going to commit murder and sell Fentanyl and deal you know right incredible harm to whatever Community they wind up in and there are member of MS-13 and they're going to there's both things that are going on at the same time and you're a heartless person if you don't want that lady with a child from Guatemala to come over here and do better and she's probably going to work as hard if not harder than any good old-fashioned red-blooded American that's over here trying to make their way through this

and why should we be able to have this opportunity when they can yeah one of the beautiful things about America right it's like if you're a poor person and you live in Baltimore you can get your shit together and get out and you can move to maybe Silicon Valley you can move somewhere where there's more Prosperity is more opportunity and you can get something other poor people in Baltimore her there are okay I heard there's pay attention some sort of there's a word what is the word you used infestation infestation of rats on crustacean yeah you can't use infestation when you're talking about certain neighborhoods people get mad even though he said infested with crime and rats he's still your racist doesn't matter that the key here is and it's a democratic talking point right I mean this is a this is a strategy and that's fine both parties use different strategies on you know but the Dems have obviously decided in this period of time because it's so intense there was clearly discussions within wherever the DNC or elsewhere that this is our policy we are going to push this and we're just you just keep hammering that work racist racist racist no matter what

and it's going to stick and it does yes because you just you get hit by that hammer and you kind of you're staring into the light you don't know how to respond sure right so and you think oh my God I'm not a racist but then you know you're like Senator you're still beating your wife and so it's one of those things you can't you can't answer but I think it's bullshit because it's like calling everybody a not see it you know it loses its its importance and its and its meaning and you know anyway it's a strange strange time but I think you can do both you can you can take care of that that woman with the kid or kids and and you can also you know look at the issue of border security right and enhance your ability to understand who's coming across the border right cost money in it and it requires effort but you can do you can do both I don't I think you can do both but the I think the real big picture the real big picture like if you had a look at the solution of objectively the real problem is Mexico has

like real economic situations that we don't have here in America there are far worse off and a lot of the areas and as is Guatemala as is neighbor El Salvador or neighboring countries are economically devastated until they are not until they come up and until they experience Prosperity you're always going to have people that are committing crime because they want to try to get by and you're always going to have people that are want to going to want to try to get to America because it's a place where there's more opportunity yeah the real issue the real issue is that it's so much better over here right and that's and that makes sense and you get the same thing with immigration and movement of of people over in Europe coming in from from wherever which is the max of I'd write which is the brexit argument in part I mean it's not just based on immigration but it's more control of your own nation's security and Destiny Etc but I think that that's You could argue that National Security from a u.s. perspective would warrant improving your ability to impact Nations like Guatemala

El Salvador wherever in working with Mexico to not just improve sort of the security the liaison that goes on and improving that but you're right I mean working conditions criminal you know our crime and instability that's in our national security I know people get you know they get very upset so why should we give countries money right well in part you're right I mean sometimes you give him money and it just goes down some shithole and it doesn't you know I don't mean to I'm not talk about the country I'm just starting to literally goes into a hole and never heard back yet sin and Corruption by and they absorb it at the highest levels of government yeah and so there's no there's no controls over how that money is spent there's no there's no metrics to say whether it's spent wisely at the end of the day so you can you but I would argue that yeah I agree I mean it's in our national security interest when we're talking about border security immigration to view that as sort of the Top Line issue why are they why are they on the Move well like you said they're on the move because they want a better life because where they're at and good

yes how do you work with them and that's you know that's I think people sometimes look at that thing that's pushing a rock up a hill it's never going to happen and so maybe they just stopped right but we've ignored Latin America Central America South America for decades right which is how we ended up in part with with Chavez and you know Maduro to follow and some of the horseshit that went on down there because we ignored it we didn't give it the resources we didn't give it the attention we didn't treat it seriously as a national security concern we're all focused on where ever improving relationships in Southeast Asia or elsewhere

so yeah we need to refocus and I think ultimately do we see it immediately no but I think you're so anyway it's you know I think for people that are really like a foreign policy it is yeah but with at least one dude who doesn't know jack shit about foreign policy that would be me the biggest show though but I yeah maybe but I really think in the interest of National Security legalizing marijuana federally would stop the profitability of these gang members because you would be able to have legal marijuana you wouldn't have to be able to you wouldn't need to buy it and these are the places you be able to grow it yourself and the price would drop through the fucking floor and it would be not profitable for these guys to haul three miles of pipe on their back and into the backcountry and use someone else's land make these grow-ops and one of the reasons why they're doing this particularly in California I found out is that when marijuana became legal in California these illegal grow-ops became a misdemeanor rather than a felony so they do them over here and instead of doing it in Ohio or somewhere else where it's illegal they do

so it's you know you could basically grow year round here I was going to say from a logistical point of view but if they just made it legal federally this cut the shit we're all grown-ups you know there's a tremendous number of issues related to the fact that you know the state and the federal laws don't match up right and from a law enforcement perspective it's a nightmare nightmare ship so nightmare yeah I agree you know what I you know what will happen is I don't imagine that it makes the cartel activity any different that sucking sound that would that is the revenues from from weed leaving their their accounts will be replaced by something else for sure there are getting the weed business Yeah well yeah well yeah I mean oh yes pharmaceutical companies that are fighting against it as well as these prison guard unions which is really crazy that's the darkest one to me it's not the pharmaceutical companies look I get it there just creeps that are looking at their bottom line that every business wants to constantly have new growth every year they want to constantly be making more money I get it it's like this Universal Eternal growth model that they operate under but the

en garde unions when you find out that they Lobby against the legalization of marijuana is so insane what does that I didn't know they just want more people in jail so that they have jobs that's the idea behind it it's the most unamerican thing possible you want more people in jail so that you could have a job looking over those people you basically it's sickening yeah that's that's a new one to me I hadn't had no idea they guard unions yeah yeah yeah I don't pat in prisons in a nutshell about fucking Christ yeah private prisons is something that you know and there have been I mean again I'm with this current Administration you know there's been some prison reform issues that have been making their way through right they've been actually focused on it to some degree maybe thanks to Kim Kardashian yeah okay she said she's just looking at yeah fuck yeah she got a champion of people that are wrongly incarcerated she really is I want to show you something I'm like shout out to Kim K I'm like one of the yeah I'm like a crazy crazy grandpa that Clips newspaper articles out

in preparation for the show I know most people think I do no preparation whatsoever I know rhinos guys I still do too I love the newspaper I do as well thank you look at this college is offered degree and courses in the pot business could move yeah yeah so this is probably asking to now did you know that pot is a teaching podcast and of two people that have gone back to school for that for podcasting enough for pot five degrees Yeah Yeah it's crazy University of Maryland and Cornell that's the to that this article talks about well the biggest sponsorship that the UFC is ever gotten ever is this Aurora company in Canada the grows we'd CBD and marijuana they have football fields filled with weed and you know the highest possible standards the best quality no pesticides herbicides no bullshit super pure and the CBD which is fantastic for Everybody's Health and I just I'm back when I first started working for the UFC they were people that work for the organization organization that didn't like it that I smoke pot they like watching smoking what's he doing it's gonna go

but now they work of them caught company yeah well I mean it's I will tell you this is a apropos of nothing I guess I've gotten calls a couple of calls from people in the industry who are saying and the only reason the calling me is the same can you hook me up with Joe is like we hang out together all the time of course right now because we're always always hanging out in the pool together Joe and I but so I said no look dude that's not my it's not my job but they want to know what they want from me you know what I think they just want to pitch you on business I want to bring some Spooks in here and fucking case The Joint yeah that's about what I do know that people in the pot yeah no people in the pot business yeah that was a racist term in the 70s well we did a black folk I worked on a show for in the UK and Espionage drama show the ran ran for eight or nine c is seasons and it was called in the UK was called Spooks it was about their Intel operation and ran for long

but then they sold the brought it over here to the states and I think it was on some Channel and but they had to change the name the change to MI5 that's just the name for the domestic security service because they were worried about the term exactly but Cia Spooks is always been around mean it's a fucking always been around the idea is that this sneaky people that are doing creepy shit there was no there is no creepy shit I hear you being done you say what I mean - I do yeah I'm here to tell you right now and you can write this down I'm going to write it down write it down there's no creepy no creepy shit the only P what's going on with Iran caught a bunch of people that they are claiming our CIA informants and they may execute them yeah yeah they've done this before they've made this claim before and look at Ron is hey that a couple of parts of this that's one of the heaviest lives in the business has been Intel collection on Iran over the years I'm not talking about just recently but over the years it's been it's been very difficult they are extremely

buttoned up over there and they have an incredible level of control over their population and then which is you know at some point you would think well maybe the population is going to object to this but you know it hasn't happened yet so part of it is they came out with this I think 17 individuals that they claimed were cooperating with the CIA in some fashion or another and they you know they claim that they were fairly high level individuals I have a I don't believe anything that comes out of their mouths I don't believe him at all I think they've got a long long track record of lying about a variety of things and so you know why would they come out with this you know perhaps they're cracking down and it doesn't hurt to come out and if you're going after some of these individuals anyway why not put them put the paintbrush on them that they're working for the CIA and that will appease some of the population there so I don't know I'm again I'm not buying it it has been a difficult until

task and collecting Intelligence on on their efforts with with their ballistic missiles their new program as well has always been as always been problematic but again they've done this before where they've talked about how we've wrapped up a CIA spying Network and it's kind of wash it it has their propaganda well yeah I mean I guess I want you know I yeah I that that would be my take on it I don't know what I mean I'm not I'm not internal I'm not inside and so you know is it possible sure we've had we've had networks wrapped up before by other countries Cuba the Cuban until service years ago right which was completely built by the Russians the way by the old KGB they owned and operated the Cuban until service for a long time still do they at one point wrapped up pretty much everybody we had on island and and how many people did we have over there three know we had you know I don't I don't remember the numbers but it was all there was a few yeah let's just say it was it was it was not good and they

they had done a very good it was from a from a counterintelligence perspective it was a pretty impressive effort so it's happened Russia's you know done the same when we've usually when with Russia usually when we've got a Trader or a go a mole you know somebody like Robert Hanssen Jim Nicholson never seen at least showered the Americans for when I understand it's a good show it was a show based on the idea that at one point in time there was a Russian family that had come over here and infiltrated and became American citizens and seem like you know Joe and Mary next door right but really they were Russian spies you don't have an aunt an uncle named Joe and Mary so weird that you would say that I literally had an uncle named Joe and Mary well I've done some Intel on you buddy trying to look at that it's time to go yeah there was you know there was a story the reason that the Americans was created was written as do a lot of things do based on some smartrider who sees an opportunity because he reads a newspaper right years back

2011 I think it was we had a Sleeper Cell that we wrapped up in Jersey mmm there was there that's where this takes place right and it was that one that the hot one remember oh that's right yeah the hot broad the hot thing and everybody get off Russian right and so bring them over and then you look at you think that hat well I mean we could I think she's forgetting what her name was you're a fat Deanna Watering your lawn and she walked over extort ya got high heels on yeah well she looks wearing nothing but that's all yes hot bro you don't think she's hot so much there's something about her look I know that there's some butter knows you integration Ever Knows ya know she's hot you don't think that lady looks hot not there no they're not a good picture I saw your picture you did mug shot one up there check and she's any makeup now that's true that about her up yeah put a little tartar upcoming European chick that chick catches you with a couple of Jack Daniel's and you got trouble I'm like I she walks across when you're mowing the lawn you're writing a bit so so shield and a bunch of other

lived in Jersey in the suburbs and their whole reason for being with just a spot people write it was it wasn't they were not you know these were not the heads of the of the organization right so their job is spot people live there be you know social meet people that might be of interest maybe it turns out that somebody in the PTA where your kids go to school maybe somebody's working for Raytheon it they're working for some you know interesting company that's what they do so that's their job their job was to basically the spot and then you've got other people in that chain of events who are a little bit higher up the food chain who then assess right and we'll look at that person and go yeah there's maybe there's something that is person works for whatever company and you know that be it could be it doesn't matter what the company is by the way could be Qualcomm could be think of one that because the application could be Corning could be anything there's all sorts of companies out there that have applications that may be of interest from an Intel perspective for a hostile state so then you know they do a little assessment and maybe they come away and go yeah yeah that person's interesting jobless develop a little

chip there now maybe one of those individuals will work on that relationship and maybe somebody else will come in you know within this this group and they'll develop a relationship and then you know maybe they'll task the person so maybe it's a the guy works at a tech company and you know you're going to think okay I want to see if this person has any weaknesses you know how you know it can I leverage anything here and so what you'll say is you know my kid you know it's doing this school paper and it's on you know something and okay I can't you know they just not getting in it or they're not doing the research or whatever he do you have anything you know and you're not asking for any classified you're just saying look you work in a tech company you know don't you have something that would be of interest you know my kids got to write the stupid paper and and you're not looking for anything of Intel value you're looking to see whether they'll accommodate you and will they actually come back and go yeah well you know what we got this and it's kind of interesting and it's as you know research paper that's you know been out in the press for a long time but yeah it's

testing a you know hands it over he will know you maybe you got something right now you got something that you can see that they're responded to a little task and then you'd so you set the hook a little bit and then you just keep on working on that so in the meantime they're calling back to the KGB and saying we have got who work with Ruthie on write notes information just and they say it just like that with that very accent they keep jobs and everything so they work they go to work every day go to work maybe they don't maybe they're a spouse you know a stay-at-home spouse but what do they do they hang out with other stay-at-home spouses and create friendships because of kids and the next thing you know you all haven't dinners with each other and you don't like you like that Russian broad she's banging everybody right well I know you wouldn't do that that would be a very disruptive thing to do in that Community right let's go isn't that the premise of the Americans in the show but I watch One banks people I watched I watched about half an hour of the first episode and then I just get angry no I just sit there and I got I'm a very hard person to watch shows like that with and so so my wife was like I just said no you can't you can't see it because it's like I can tell

going like yeah but it was good you know for sure and it was good show with a show where people play pool no I can't really play pool Mike fuck yeah I was I was just in the UK and boy I tell you what if I turn on the TV and there's a snooker match on I'm in there snooker I'm in there right I'll just sit and sit and watch snooker she's over there oh my God but it's also it's one of those things where either you can sit and watch it or you're like golf or you can't I just haven't for some reason I've got some defect that allows me to sit and watch a billiard match have you ever played it's tough It's hard yeah I we have a pool table at home that the boys have become pretty damn good at which is a skill or life skill but yeah Billiards is a weld pool is no hard different new kurz way harder yeah it's way harder they excel in American pool I don't think any American player has ever gone over there and excelled in snooker I don't I don't believe so yeah yeah maybe something for I know

I've tried but not only anybody's succeeded but there's been a ton of guys from England yeah that have come over here and they do very well on the American pool tour but you know what we do better on his displays bowling we do we kick the shit out of them when it comes to bowling yeah but that's an American thing well yeah there you go they Bowl come over here and bowl I don't think so no I don't think so I don't think of this but it's been that migration and sweat equally stupid sport yeah and they get really mad when I say that I've got all these texts me you fucking ignorant I'm not the rolling a ball at these things you have to pick them back up again if you ever bowled sober I don't think I've ever bolts yeah both my kids always sober my kids love bowling yeah and they put up the little bumper thing so it doesn't go in the gutter so you cheating yeah so you just basically whip that fucking thing down there a hundred miles an hour that's an ideal my thrill is to hear those what's up for me

would you like it's on the floor you let your kids win and thanks all the time yeah all the time but I did get a hamstring injury because I didn't let my kid beat me in a race I'll she's 11 okay that was rough I was running I knew something was going on like who cares push through she's not winning my fucking hamstrings hurting my my middle boy Sluggo face basketball that's all he wants to do day and night and he's a bit like the sort of like the rain man of basketball to so in terms of facts figures characters if he can go back to Jerry West and he'll tell you about Bill Russell's career anything but he loves basketball does he want to play professionally yes he does yeah so how tall are you you know it doesn't look like it but in in a deep fake video I look about six foot ten but what are you like 60 61 not quite six with yeah you got to give to get that kid on growth hormones yeah well well he already loved up yes but that's all he does he plays and he just constantly and he just all he wants to do is play and so he got to the point where

you know for a long time I would just we go out we got a court at home and I'd play and and I kind of let them as its and then it gets to the point where I can't really beat him I've got Hyde on him right right but his handles are extremely good and so and I'm not the fastest kid on the Block anymore and so it's gotten to the point now where he's legitimately beat me a handful of times and it's very embarrassing because he doesn't really have an edit button so he he just rubs that shit out right and it's like it's like it's like The Lion King when Scar wants to take over and he's just like that was pretty good wasn't The Lion King yeah friends it's good reference yeah so anyway you gotta let him do that though it's an exercise for you and patience so when he's talking shit that's how I look at it my kids talk shift they beat me I just go okay go ahead talk ah shit yeah and that's like you can't can't let it be personal yeah now the treat it like almost like an internet Heckler yeah well kids are allowed to hit me full blast so my kids take martial arts and I let them not the old

old Stones 22 she'll fuck me up yeah but the young ones I let them tee off on me they they're allowed to full blast leg kick me they can hurt me yeah they'll hurt you yeah but I want them to be able to feel what it feels like to actually hit a person because when you're sparring in martial arts class you're not allowed to like hit people full blast just kind of touch them you know and so I let them just fucking slam shins into my thighs and I teach them how to turn it over and dig the really dig that bone into the sauce bar that's good that's that's actually really good I can hurt sometimes though but it's good when we are same problem with my with my boys because they are fairly competitive in their aggressive and you know I keep telling him I said look and punched in the face isn't good and you know until you actually do well you know they've gotten into some in this um I was gonna say 50 cups I don't know if you can say that you okay you know how does it fit I guess it was together time yeah we're continuing to talk over there and he's nice

that's a hard time with water but yeah it's hard to teach your kids you know what that's like right and you know at some point you know maybe they go through that the youngest one broke his nose courtesy of the older the old moons a Mugsy got his nose broke in a contest with with the older one the oldest one scooter and he found out that's no fun the thing is though that kids going to be the tough one yeah the kid that it's always the youngest ones like you see in the UFC when there's older brothers and younger brothers the older brothers General generally pick on the younger brothers and the younger brothers once they reach adulthood almost always can fuck up the older brothers yeah it's really weird yeah yeah I was I took a lot of beatings when I was younger cause I'm the youngest of four boys I make sense and so yeah I but it's yeah it's good it's good stuff and oh my God it's this this it's constant entertainment all right I mean you know what it's like you know kids is always something and I'm sure right now people are going oh my God he's gonna start talking

those kids again at length and they come out to do that yeah because you kids names are so cartoonish yeah I know well part of the reason why they get mad as they are but anyway so what we talked about Russians yeah look it's what it like I like I'm just like Uncle Joe here I've cut out some some shit to talk about a deep fakes we talked about that okay well I wrote down some notes to my God I was prepared for you are prepared never been prepared for your show before and you know why did you decide to get prepared this time you know why because because you've got you've got some really great guests well no not really but viewers listeners I mean I was trying to the people that follow this show I find to be really fascinating I get a lot of feedback and I feel like you know yeah I should pay attention that I should I should prepare a little bit because there's a lot of interest right and some of these things that we talked about

and you know so well sometimes I go out and I winged it you know and to be fair on new segments I just make shit up now I don't I don't do that I know you wanted to talk about Huawei Huawei honk Huawei which I think is a really fascinating subject to me and a lot of people that are Tech inclined because they are at the tip of the spear when it comes to technological innovation the cell phone space and I know that they're doing that with in regards to modems and a bunch of other things as well but it appears at least and a lot of companies are exclusively using their 5G modems as 5G rolls out oh yeah but it appears there they are involved in some serious Shenanigans and they have deep roots with the Chinese government they do they claim they don't they claim look we're independent we would never do whatever the Chinese authorities say think about that sentence think about a company with the global reach of Huawei of that importance to the Chinese State and think about them saying trying to say with a straight face we wouldn't we wouldn't do you know things at the

nice government might ask us to do it look so real Chinese company and you said that you meant it they would shut yeah exactly like you won't yeah you would not be in business for that long or they would be a change in the Senior Management of the business so and who always been caught out they've been caught out in Europe to the degree where at a certain point you think Germany and others that are deeply involved with while way now in terms of the 5 G infrastructure where they've just made this decision look it's financially better for us to work with Huawei and we can set aside the security risks they're literally made that decision that was reading an article about that very recently that they've just decided to have some sort of a risk to reward conversation and the risk is worth the reward right right and so you know that's that's their calculation from a u.s. perspective because we are you know look there's there's two essentially to

superpowers now right I mean China's you know advancing and and we're not the lone superpower on the stage anymore and so we are the number one Target and you know our calculation has to be different so we've been going at it and I know it but I think it's been it's been pretty well covered didn't used to be covered very well but it's been pretty well covered over the past couple of months and now what's happening is we've been in these trade negotiations with China and I think unfortunately I think the current Administration the Trump Administration is going to Blink and I think there because Huawei is such a huge issue for the Chinese and the idea that we would prevent our companies from selling into or purchasing from or dealing with and that we were have sanctions on other countries that do they view that as such a threat to their own interests and their own future that Huawei is front and center with any trade deal

they're looking they're not doing any trade deal unless we make concessions on Huawei and I have a feeling the Trump Administration is going to make those concessions because political perspective they want a trade deal right and so far they've actually said to Google that Google's going to stop using the Android operating system for the Chinese phones for wha ways phones at least they're going to not let them license out the so while ways actually been at least rumored to be in production of their own operating system which would mean they would have to have their own not just operating system but they did have to have their own ecosystems that have to have an app store they have to have all the all the Jazz that we have today when you sign up for you buy an Android phone you have access to the Google Play Market which is this huge resource of applications and soon as you take that away you've got to kind of rebuild that whole thing from scratch right right well while we doesn't lack anything in resources you know they'll be fine you know because it's either the state will provide ensure that they have the resources they need they also

now where the outlier here right I mean we've been working with New Zealand and Canada and you know the UK to some degree but the UK has been you know they kind of push it back a little bit on this idea that we're going to isolate Huawei I don't think that's going to happen is they're using Huawei devices they to some degree yes they've been slower to adopt and kind of mesh their infrastructure with while ways for people here for people don't know what we're talking about could you please just lay out what's the concern what do they think that Huawei is doing while way is essentially

what's it did the way to put this would be imagine a Communications Network that spans the globe and Huawei builds and provides gear and certainly going into 5G there are leading provider and so and then financially they they can offer countries much better deals than other providers but they are an intricate part of that Communications web so if you imagine that Huawei is a state sponsored entity and will respond to Chinese authorities request for information or intelligence that's passing through this Communications web around the globe are our business Communications our military Communications intelligence Communications that all kind of go through at some point this interconnected system that's the problem because they're essentially building back doors into

at system that allow them to suck Communications out of that Network and use it for their own purposes it's a great intelligence tool right so if you think about it in a way basically they it's a it's an advancement on the idea that you are wiretapping somebody or you know you've created ability to intercept some Communications right they link themselves with the EU well what happens we've got military Communications right with the EU our military talks to the you military and and we've got NATO concerns and everything so if there's an element in that infrastructure that touches in and has a door that opens to some walkway gear right then the danger here is and they've they've had back doors discovered in the past and then while we put your hands up and go oh well we didn't know that was there will correct it and then it turns out they don't correct it and then you know sorry about that you know they don't they they honestly don't give a shit they I when I say how aggressive they are in terms of sucking up information I can't overstate it

and so this that's why it's a problem for us because you know if we if we convince Australia and and you know the five eyes Nations New Zealand as and in others not to work with while way and then say Canada you know which is willing to do a deal well we've got seamless Communications infrastructure with Canada so all of a sudden the fact that they're doing business while way but we're not we're still a risk we're still in Jeopardy because that information is still flowing to some degree where it's accessible to Huawei and their ability to get at so I you know again I don't people listen to that and they go why is that of any concern well it's a concern because used to be in the old days it was a you know it was us in the Russians so Union Russia's you know they got that GDP of a small EU Nation China is on the March they view themselves in a certain fashion that's why they're pushing out in the South China Sea the

building up their military they've been doing deals all over the world for Rare Earth minerals to you know to labor Joseph access to Naval ports doesn't matter what it is they've been busy doing that because they view themselves at the top of the food chain now I guess we could say well okay fine maybe it's their turn or something but I that's not how I view the world I had I mean we can either be on top but we can you know be sucking wind and so he goes back to that one of those early questions you asked is how much do we spend on defense how much do we spend on an Intel how much do we spend on whatever it may be and I think the answer is that's where intelligence comes in you have to know what the opposite with the Hostile nation is doing have to know what the competitor is doing it's like in business then you have to spend enough to stay ahead of that right even if it's a small amount you got to stay ahead you got and it's it behooves us not to fall behind that's never a good thing I know we don't always do things right but as a nation the world is much better off with us

sort of at that and this is going to sound wrong to a lot of people are going to think oh my God that's terrible but with us at the top were more altruistic maybe that is I don't know if that's the word or not but I think word yeah so anyway so I that's that's my view lot of people say bullshit but you know everyone's got different experiences you know well is there a way to detect like when they release a if they would release a Huawei phone and which is a really rich really interesting that just a few years ago while way was not even a major player by any stretch of the imagination now it's the number two cell phone provider in the world past Apple which is incredible when you consider the fact that they barely have a foothold in the American Market they very few people by their phones and if they do by their phones they buy unlocked phones from overseas yeah it's really kind of crazy but is there a way where they could detect whether or not there is a back door in these phones I mean or is it something where

it could develop it to the point where you really would have no idea no we can we stay pretty well

you know that your yeah it's a good it's a good question but I would say that as long as we continue what we're doing in terms of counterintelligence and and Tech advances and efforts in in cyberspace and elsewhere and certainly in Communications Hardware to stay ahead of potential hostile activity I think we're okay we were good at detecting problems we're good at identifying weaknesses in these systems the problem is again it's a global Community we can't isolate ourselves in terms of communications infrastructure just doesn't work so if you know it's like a chain and a weak link yeah see I gave that analogy yeah good yeah thank you I made that you are the weakest link you are exactly so yeah it's I mean anyway but that's why way and I do think that it is the interesting part will be what does the administration do in their desire to get a trade deal are they willing to

link on this because they put their foot down right and now because we're so dysfunctional here in the States from a political perspective now you've got people like Chuck Schumer going well you know Trump better not blink on this is employed so suddenly Chuck Schumer is a hawk on his are not protecting us from from you know Chinese Espionage right and but simply because you know he sees as a political opening here you know if Trump backtracks on quality now hey good from the Democratic perspective they can use that to bang on em you know so it's all it all comes down to politics but but this is something that people didn't even understand was an issue like good nationally this is something I know one was even aware of until a few months ago and when I started reading about it one of the first things that I was reading about was you know I'm kind of a technology nerd and so I was fascinated by some of their newest phones which were really far Advanced to what you're getting offered in the United States yeah and a lot of that ability to create in record time comes from that

the actual part of an actual property yeah and that's how they over the years again that was a that was a collective decision by the authorities there that this is how we're going to advance right and we we they looked and they make a calculation that says we can't afford to wait decades while we do our own research and development you know Willits let's just take it and Huawei is not the only Chinese phone manufacturer there's quite a few different ones over there but they're the only one that seems to be banned butts out of the ones Ami what there's quite a few there are but Huawei has been because of their size their and their connection to the government and because of the resources that the government's been willing to to provide to them the advantage that they have and the speed with which they were able to kind of embed themselves into other nations telecommunications infrastructure that's why they're so important I'd put the general yeah that you know are there other companies we well of course yeah and there's a variety of companies we should be worried about it from that perspective and it's not like they'd be fair

I'd spend some time on China because it's just you know they're the number one state you know sponsored perpetrator of theft of intellectual property but you know there's other countries involved in it they copy entire cities which is really insane you seem like they have a fake Paris over there yeah yeah I know well you know they've got you go some of these places and looked and in Chinese history culture is fantastic right now I've been over there and times and I'm just like marveled at how you know how interesting the people are friendly they are how I mean they look this there's a lot of wonderful things about China but I'm just saying the authorities right the government policy of no rule of law of the no protection when it comes to intellectual property all these things in their aggressiveness and stealing information that's the problem but China is a country is a fascinating place so that was I don't know why I said that that's my it is a fascinating place it's very very very very very old which is something that we don't totally understand that was a five varies

think about like when you look at the history of China it's really it's amazing yeah it goes back so far when you look at this country it's a couple of hundred years and that's it I know that we come across a house it's a hundred years old and someone slaps a historic there you can't suddenly can't do anything to it right we face that in the past where I know guys got a house is built in the 20s and they have a stork thing on it the 1927 the pound symbol Be the architecture of the 60s that we want to protect ya problem plastic over couches member yeah oh that was that was a good thing right you know and nobody wanted to sit on those in the summer what what do you think is going to happen with you really think the government's gonna cave and we're going to give into one I think so because I think they really they they definitely want to trade deal in some capacity and China is not going to Blink on this right they'll figure out how to add a kind of bear the burden of the tariffs and make things work on you know for them to the great much gets built over there to meet all the Apple stuff's getting built over there now and there was just a recent story

where Tim Cook was trying to get Trump to back down off of some tariffs because you know the Can I have a 25% tariff on some Apple products that they're building in China yeah yeah and it's the idea that look it's not the idea that you can yeah wow way Revenue jumps 23 percent despite u.s. Crackdown yeah because look overseas their phones are gigantic they figured out you know Samsung made a huge disastrous mistake with their Galaxy fold no no I know but right over the foldable phone well they have a mate X that apparently is way better than the Galaxy fold it's a better design and it's viable works yeah Samsung's an incredible company and it's got an amazing history of innovation and Technology but but you're right they have had a couple of they've had a couple of missteps of fold wasn't the only one that they had a misnomer 07 that blow up right that's a product right when you go to the phone that explodes that's not necessarily what you want in a Communications device what would you point out of why way made X is not really as good as said what it says

design changed just a few weeks before the release well what's wrong with them out yet they just decide to change the don't know yeah but it doesn't mean it's not better why you saying means it's not better the people that have tried it if said it's better just saying it's last-minute tweaks have been made in the device ahead of the anticipated release in September as an additional sensor peers have been added to the phone's camera module that's to find out where you live exactly that's doesn't mean it's not better Jamie that's not yet so how would anybody know the people that have reviewed it there's people that are reviewed it all the tech sites have written a just changed you just don't yeah well they just retweet the sensor yeah talking shit over there buddy want to go back to coffin on water you anti hello it's no no what is your name to like a licensed it for their camera I don't think that they're using like like a cameras until they're not it's like a I've used it I use it at CES like three years ago I thought these like a cameras for the main Pro or whatever it is they use the name

I don't believe that it's not I mean it might be a like a sensor but it's like a very it's a microchip it's compared to the one I have in this camera that's very of course it's very difference between all the camera but I mean I think these Leica lenses right or like a something good God but can we get to the bottom of this when I was there so I was super interested in it I was trying to tell us like what are they using about this name there's a photographer I follow that was promoting it and I was like it just seems like they're using the name is all I couldn't do it

our photo I couldn't tell you don't even have optimization they're just use my name but yeah so I couldn't tell it all you don't know they're not right yeah baseless accusation I couldn't tell but as a photographer I couldn't I could like all you're using is the name this isn't a better photo it's not doesn't have the value of the like it well that's good they have some pretty spectacular camera so yeah I mean there they had the very best ever night vision camera not night vision but night sight like the ability to take photographs at night and you it looks like pull up by Huawei night photograph examples because it's Google pixel 3 is the second best one but the best one is supposedly the Huawei well the zoom came out a couple months ago people were saying that that was bullshit which what is that it was like I had a super zoom technology lens that people are similar to riding and ragging is no way that that's real but who said it's no way that that's real it's ographers photographers reviewers people that are using the this stuff and said but they weren't using this though they want just one thing has been proven one thing has been

proven that Huawei has taken some photographs and said they were taking out of Huawei phone and they were actually taken on a very high-end yeah very high-end camera oh also while we posted some stuff on Instagram from iPhones and couple take a cut a couple times doing that which is also quite hilarious but yeah it's a it's a sneaky business and if that's how they're going to do it they're going to get in through the back door and get information through phones and modems and and it may not be a you know it may not be something that they worry about now in terms of access and people say well why do they want the access now they just want to know that they can I mean imagine a conflict in the future where they have that ability right either to real time monitor Communications through this network that they've been able to build trap doors into you know or to impact the flow of communication more aggressively more proactively to do things it's you know it's like it's like mapping out our infrastructure right

the testing the probing that goes on of our of our electrical grid as an example I mean that's just planning for the future and in the event that something bad's going to happen if there's going to be a conflict you know they want to know as do we I mean again to your point that you know hopefully we're doing the same stuff and so yeah it's something else interesting when you talk about China though is and and you think about okay what should we be watching we touched on Russia a little bit is the alliance between possible alliance between Russia and China and it's an interesting Dynamic you know traditionally Russia China haven't been together they've always been some areas of concern you know distrust but there are signs there are things happening that appear as if China and Russia have made a strategic decision to align themselves closer and that would be because they've made that determination that somehow it's in their best interests of

you know not necessarily that it's going to be that way for any long period of time but right now in the current environment you see Russia acting as if what they want is a stronger Alliance military Alliance and political Alliance economic alliance with China and it's an interesting Dynamic that we need to be watching we need to be aware of and part of that is you know people again this this idea that you know there was this Russia Trump collusion and thinking okay well that's good except our relations with Russia have been this bad in a long time so maybe it's all very clever mind game that they're playing because they're closely aligned but I don't think so so we've actually laid on more significant sanctions on Russia we've attacked them from an energy perspective in terms of our ability to create our independence you know particularly from natural gas

is that is damaged Russia's abilities so I think there's reasons why they're gravitating towards China right now but this idea that somehow Trump is super friendly and as a useful idiot Putin it doesn't doesn't play out when you look at the reality of the relationship between the two countries the whole Russian collusion thing is a very confusing there and of because on one hand you have the Democrats who are saying without doubt there's Russian collusion and then the other side you have the Republicans say the Mueller Mueller report essentially exonerated Trump from being a part of any sort of rush inclusion I don't think either one is totally accurate I think there's a lot of like weird gray yeah both narratives I think that the Democrat narrative is easier to understand it just makes sense from their perspective why ones how we won why wouldn't we push that to this day they're just still amazed that they lost and so there must be some Grandeur reason why because we just have clearly we could

lose to this guy right and so and it was also a talking were much less you know let's hit everybody with the racist Hammer it's a talking point and it's worked for them over to the police the first couple of years on the on the on the Republican side look the Russians knew what they were doing right they were fucking with the election on several different levels it wasn't just trolling through the internet it wasn't you know just placing stories that they could it wasn't just trying to foment you know divisiveness and discontent it was also doing these little dangle things you know where they're you know they're looking to see what are they going to bite what are they going to do you know I'm you think about that Christopher steel dossier that was a piece of shit I mean if we saw that in the commercial side of things you know I've got a business and Global intelligence and research and security that thing was just there was nothing it was shot full of holes right and so you think we'll what somebody should have asked tell me about your sources you know why are your sources talking what was you know you've got to

anytime you've got a piece of intelligence right you got to do a few basic things you know where to come from you just kind of people to steal dossier was all about yeah it was basically just it looked they were going after opposition research political opposition research and so Christopher Steele who was a you know a paid hired Consultants used to be with British intelligence not you know not a James Bond type but you know decent Enough by all accounts a decent enough guy but he entered the world of private sector information gathering right I've got a company that's what we do all around the world and and you you can't relax your standards just because you're now in the commercial sector right when you get a piece of information you need to test that piece of information and one of the first things you need to do is understand what's the sourcing for it and wide why did they have access you know how credible are they what's their track record and why by the way are they providing this information and how did it eventually you know make its way to this report and those are the sort of simple

thanks at whether you're a corporation that's Gathering intelligence about a market that you may enter with a you know an investment or whether you're still in the business and you're a nun Intel officer and you're you know talking to a source that works in some foreign Ministry somewhere you got to be able to you know stress test the intelligence and it's just it wasn't done people people liked what they saw they saw negative information about the the candidate and just run with that shit right and the more times you it's like it's like the old wmd reporting the came out of the early days in Iraq the more you repeat it even if it's one source and that source is a piece of shit what you repeated people are going to buy it right so Rush inclusion right conclusion you just keep repeating that and that it's going to happen at some point it'll happen but anyway so but it seems like Russia definitely likes to disrupt our democracy absolutely and they wouldn't stay on the fit of that well part of it is in the old days it was sort of a struggle for

Supremacy in the world right I mean that was that's kind of at its core that's what it was right and their ability to chip away and faith in the Democratic institutions was at the core of a lot of the crap that they pulled and it still is I mean so that's all the when you're talking about a propaganda effort like the the screwing with the last election what's their goal the goal isn't necessarily that's where they you know do they care whether one candidate or another winds will maybe maybe they do right but you'd be hard-pressed to argue that you know they were working against Hillary Clinton who had said you know we want to have a reset and you know and have a new relationship with Russia and work with I mean maybe they look to Trump and thought yeah that's the guy we want to work with but over that the more important issue was in just chipping away at Americans belief in Democratic institutions get us all so that we question The credibility of a democracy and that's

bend the fundamental belief for propaganda efforts within the old KGB and now the FSU and and so it's you know it's a simple as that in a way and it worked and look at this you know we spent years now just bitching at each other and yelling and screaming and complaining and we bought into it because we all like we talked about before we all you know we're easily duped and and I don't know how you get around that I know how he walked that back maybe we don't but I think it's an informed public that that helps to battle this but we haven't we lost sight of what was important here and that it and so I think the public needs it's a responsibility you like this yeah you like where you live then you got to make an effort to try to keep it right and you and part of that is being an informed public and understanding what hostile elements may be out there you know without being paranoid but just understand why they're doing things in the way that the world operates you know and you'll always have that group of people that you know don't buy into any of that bullshit and think it's all just

we should all be holding hands yeah that's a that's a that's a fun one that's that's a fun narrative it's a good narrative it's a happy narrative right when you talk to people that have seen terrible things that take place all around the world that narrative is hard to swallow like when you read about these gang members that are coming in and growing pot and fucking shooting at people and they've had these high level task force just to deal with these cartel members that are growing weed in this is right and that's just one part of what they're doing right that's just human trafficking and everything else that they get involved in extortion and all which is probably the scariest thing yeah yeah and that's it and that's that's what you have to worry about if you have push them out of the market because you legalize everything which you know I assume that's kind of the direction we're going then do they fill that Gap again from a revenue perspective with fentanyl or something else whatever the next choice is how do you stop the infiltration how do you stop the gang members for coming in here and how

do you do that other than eliminating them other than having some sort of a tactical operation well that seems like the only operation that would make any sense in my mind yeah well it's like jihadism you can't kill your way out of it right doesn't mean you shouldn't make a good faith effort but it's for the for the for the drug control for the narcotics counter-narcotics part of it is what we talked about also about working with the other governments right we've had some success in doing that what you work with the Mexican authorities you work with Colombians or Out in southeast Asia you know to try to you know push on the back on the heroin trade and so you work through them to some degree but that stuff right that much corruption is so much corruption and and that's and that's that's the problem and it's and it's unsatisfying because you don't see an immediate return sometimes and it's and it's also it's a sometimes seems like it's just a big you know bottomless pit where you're tossing money right and effort and resources but it's something that

has to be done doesn't mean you shouldn't still do it but it is I mean corruption in in a place like Mexico right where the people just don't have any faith in the institutions because they lived in this system for so long where all the officials in their minds anyway or corrupt the police are corrupt the federales are corrupt you know the Marines down in Mexico or probably the most trusted institution because they're not viewed in the same vein they're not viewed as corrupt but only the Marines well yeah pretty much I mean that's it which it's odd but it's a that's a large organization and they've been able to kind of stay above The Fray to some degree which is interesting I have no idea but it's it's it's been the perception and just for the most part it's true when you work down there often enough you do get that impression but it's how do you get rid of that endemic corruption in that society and turn that public perception around you know because that will impact

but I mean look what happened previous administration when they seriously went after a cartel members remember that spree of violence that kicked off it was in part because the Mexican authorities were going after cartels in a more serious manner right they previously that they were managing the problem so they said okay look let's manage down the violence everybody and we'll let you keep doing your business it's going to happen so you guys do your business but just you know let's keep sort of public order you know as something that we want to demonstrate that we're capable of and when you have to when they went after the cartels in a more serious manner that's when that real parse spree of violence kicked off and you know there was more Headroom so these you know the various members were you know they were combating each other and they were going after the public they understood that they had to you know basically we're down the public which is what happened the public said after a while they said fuck it we can't deal with this the violence is too much it's awful and so government you know eventually went back to managing the problem drug trade in go away of course

they just went back to the old way of doing things so but the violence is just so intense the public eventually just so we can't know and and I think the cartels knew that they understood that right and so they were willing to do it well the most ridiculous aspect was that fat fast and furious deal where they were literally selling drugs to the cartels so they could track them and those drugs we use to eventually kill some u.s. officers right yeah I mean it was yeah so that's those rugs except rocks yeah yeah conflating things yeah those guns that they used they did Kill officers right yeah there was there was a mobster in particular was that was killed and the The Fast and Furious anytime you talk about

it's time you talked about as part of a intelligence collection effort right or law enforcement effort that you're going to supply the Hostile element with weapons or whatever maybe it's gonna go it's probably going to go sideways right seems like a great way to cover the fact that you were selling guns and if I was really skeptical I would say what are you gonna do we're gonna sell them guns how the fuck you gonna sell them guns well we're going to say that it's an intelligence-gathering thing selling guns yeah we don't really cynical yeah a lot of people are a lot of people are ya know I mean I think it was it was a fucked-up operation there's no doubt about it and I'm not a fan of you know it's sort of like the same in the gray arms marketing you know sort of like a global basis when you talk about you know like you know because again what are you looking to do you looking to create movement track you know movement of gear or money or resources or personnel and there's ways you can do that you know without creating

potential for a complete goat rope and unfortunately Fast and Furious did that well that was the had to be a goat rope you giving people the ability to kill people yeah giving them guns yeah like what and what do they have chips and the guns like how they even tracking these goddamn guns yeah it that sources and methods shit but it's yeah I going back to Mexico and how do you you know how do you resolve that because that impacts again that impacts us impacts our national security right yeah Max and so well they're literally connect it to us yeah we're so concerned with Afghanistan and Iraq but nowhere near us and we've got this thing connected to us that's literally filling this country with illegal drugs they sell meth they sell fentanyl do Afghanistan Factor coming up on another election presidential election in mid I think mid-september but you can run you know I'm thinking about it I'm thinking about moving the family over there do and yeah gasps yeah I could me and Boris Johnson and Trump would get together but yeah

they've had an increase in bombings you know Taliban stepping it back uh Dora and I mean we don't think about it nobody wants to think about that shit anymore you think about how many years you know we've been digging in and it always comes back to the same thing the Taliban and what do we think was going to happen they got no place else to go right and so difficult to track him down yeah mountains and they will just wait it out right and so they're back again they're increasing bombings they want to take you know they want to take over again and then it's just so you're right in a sense we did we take our Eye Off the Ball yeah we did yeah and were there other issues that we should have been more focused on yeah sure but you know then you're conflicted because you think of all those people that fought and died over there and and the effort that other people that came back and you know with with horrible wounds and and the trauma of all of that and you know I feel somewhat conflicted because then you talk about you know I don't you don't want to you don't minimize there

what they did right from the contrary but you also have an obligation I think to look at policy and what did we do and what was the purpose of it was a point of that exercise and I don't think we still to this day no right I mean whatever you create some pseudo state federal government there that's going to be a Bastion of democracy and not going to happen so anyway I don't want disappeared on the Afghanistan rabbit hole but we'd like to think that we could turn that into another America that's we like to think when we think about nation building that we think that we can go in there and establish democracy and these people going to be better than going to be able to go to school and it's going to change the whole environment yeah yeah I guess and that is true and we talked about Iraq that way if we just make a rock a Bastion of democracy then maybe it'll help to to turn the tide in the Middle East and suddenly I won't have more of a respect for individual liberties and rights and all the rest of that and and how'd that work out you know I'm still looking into it it's I'll come back again and I'll give you my report I think it's going to be negative a million people have died yeah it's yeah

it's not good right that's that's typically never good when you get you get to those numbers a large number yeah but again look at I mean the shit that we don't want to talk about it we don't talk about Syria and nobody wants to talk about Syria and that and and you know Assad you know is Butcher he's still in charge while he's in charge well because Russia propped him up why did Russia problem along with Iran as and there's a there's a nasty piece of work there and as an axis goes you know Russia had no intention of letting Assad go we should have been able to figure that one out right but we didn't and in part because we have these these these impulses let's say well we're going to do better and because we're going to create this ability for people to you know create their own democracy yeah so yeah so anyway we Syria is again one of those places that nobody really wants to discuss or talk about we've got we've got attention deficit disorder nobody talks about North Korea anymore remember we're all gonna get blown up by Kim Dong gun

yeah yeah well this pictures a trump shaking his hand so we're buddies now going home yeah we're all good all good yeah I mean the last article I read about North Korea was about how did Kim Jang Hoon get his Mercedes since there's some sort of a she's a boycott or a you know embargo yeah well and that's you know that's another part of it is although we have been we've been more successful I will say this we've been more successful than that in the past and part of that is a technology issue we've gotten better at imposing and enforcing sanctions then we used to be and part of that is because our abilities to understand the movement of money tracking transactions is better than it used to be so the sanctions as an example we put on our on this is you know this is the most difficult time that this regime has faced in Iran since the fall of the Shah and it's because we've gotten better at

looking at Russia China in particular that have traditionally always kind of circumvented the sanctions we're better at enforcing that and we're better at working with the EU and pressuring them right I mean so that's that's a good thing but I don't know where that's going you know I mean Iran is kind of flailing about a little bit They seized the tanker you know British tank or that's just a couple but yeah they're holding onto one in response to they were trying to ship a bunch of oil over to Syria against sanctions that exists right so so they had a tanker that was taken two million barrels or whatever of oil over to Syria and the British in the territorial Waters of Gibraltar intercepted that ship that was the beginning of July and in response the Iranians have done a number of things right but the most recent thing that they've done and was They seized a British flag tanker and they're still holding the crew and that's sort of an example of there

I want to say they're desperate right because they've gotten ability I think the withstand and their control over the pop-up population is so strong but it's an example I think to some degree of them flailing a bit and trying to figure out what are they going to do what's their next move and I know people say well we shouldn't have gotten out of the deal and we shouldn't you know we shouldn't have this issue anyway because we you know it's Trump's fault for getting out of the deal but you know they again I don't have a lot of confidence in them sticking to the terms and agreements of any deal because they've never done in the past there's always been that have effort and they've always broken the agreement so I don't know why suddenly they would change their tune if we can keep the sanctions on hard enough and force them to the table the only thing they care about is staying in power if they think they're going to lose that grip on power they'll come to the table to make a better deal and that deal would include us being able to access their military facilities and for inspections and we couldn't we had no access to any other military sites in that country because now we didn't make it a condition of the deal right so we

Ashley said sure we want verification that you're following the agreements they said well fuck you this is the these are the places that we agree to let you look at that that was that I don't want to oversimplify but that was the terms of the deal and so we any deal that we do with them in the future needs to be able to say no we want a hundred verification because John Kerry said that's what you want you want to verify so when we heard about it what we're hearing in the news from the people that are opposed to the deal is that Trump broke this deal and he was foolhardy to do so that Obama had put in place this deal and the trumpet broke it and it sort of leaves us in this terrible quack mine right but what you're saying is that the deal was terrible and that the it didn't really give us access to understand exactly what their nuclear program was with their military program was it wasn't a good deal wasn't wasn't wise to keep it if you're if you're if if the way that you judge the the value of a deal and this is what the previous administration the Obama Administration did was to talk about how you know it's important that we verify and

we've got verification well yeah you got verification of the sites that the Iranians agreed to let us look at that and so yeah it was a deal was it a good deal know they wanted this day wanted to sign this deal in the Iranians knew it and so yeah I think that that justified saying now we're going to redraw this and even the EU which has been clinging to the old agreement even the EU says well yeah we could improve it we could make it better but there's no if you just keep things as they were there's no incentive for the Iranian regime to to make any concessions or improve it so the point being is we're going we're trying to force them back to the negotiating table and again given that their self-interest is to stay in power and and remain in charge then you know if with the economy in the condition that it's in currently if it gets much worse and they feel as if they're losing a grip on the population then I suspect it will come they're not going to lash out that Iran doesn't

nobody wants a military conflict we don't want it they don't want it yeah can they close the Strait of Hormuz you know where you know depending on who you're talking to a fifth of the world's oil passes through or yeah they could close it temporarily cause some friction but they don't have the ability to shut down for any real period of time we've just got too much in terms of Leverage over there and our assets and so yeah I you know who knows but I am one of those people that says you know we shouldn't have done that deal until we got it right and just saying if you got a deal for the sake of it because you had partial verification doesn't give you anything we've had we've had partial verification of their programs for decades and they just keep advancing their program so do you think this criticism of backing out of the deal that you're hearing from Democrats is basically just a criticism of trump to show an opportunity to yeah everything's Icarus I think everything is a criticism of trump is that a problem with because Trump is such a polemic figure because

he's so many people just hate him that any opportunity to have some sort of political talking point against him sort of confuses what the actual issue is itself yeah I mean I think it's no doubt he's yeah I think what happens is both sides we lose in this one because the Democrats just sort of blindly you know accuse him of everything is bad right and no matter what he's doing a matter what policy is it's all bad right and so so that's not what you want to be and on the Republican side you know you tend to think that that's the case and so you know you don't have an honest intelligent discussion about a map of the landscape right and so you again you were sitting in an in trenches throwing hand grenades each other and say well we're one right and nobody's going to get out and Venture into no man's land in the center nobody's living in the center anymore so I just think

it's a disservice to everybody but yes I think most things that come out of Capitol Hill right now is based on on look my his an example my daughter went she just got out of grad school and she's done a number of internships worked over in Asia spent China on internships and she's you know smart kid I'm subjective smart kid but she went for a job up in Capitol Hill and it was not a direct hire meaning they'd office had to go through the the other offices to get approval to hire an individual fill this position and because the house is controlled by democrats now

she was but he looked and said yeah she's a top candidate we want to offer the job well what happened was they submitted her details that we want to hire this person to this office within Capital Hill controlled by the Democrats now because it's a house majority and they came back and said no because you know why because she did an internship in the current Administration so young person wanting to work in DC in policy and security studies and elsewhere

doing a variety of internships around the globe doesn't internship with the White House normally you would think that's a good thing right but so they said no because she did this internship at the White House we're not going to approve the hiring and then it turns well she did an internship in Bill De Blasio's office to write and so they said that and the response was well we don't like him either which I think was that actually provided some humor right to the whole situation but it shows you not I mean that's a little tiny thing and it's a personal issue but but it shows you Washington DC is possibly the most dysfunctional location in all of North America that's terrible yeah and it's and it's and it's not the way it should be we should be able to have policy discussions we should be able to make decisions you may not like Trump you may not have liked the previous president but you know again we got to stop this bullshit where everybody's a racist everybody's a sexist everybody's like it's not the way this country supposed to work and people you know you can't even get away

okay who's at fault everybody's at fault right well what is the left are all guilty of creating this divisiveness what is this the cured outrage culture I mean how do you get past this that's the real question right mean what is the I don't see a map and I was going to ask you this about foreign policy because as a guy who has been involved in CIA for as long as you have and it has seen all the inner workings of government and all the conflict and did you ever feel like you just were just running up a 70 degrees Sand Dune that you're never going to get to the top of you know what I mean it just seems like it never ends I mean you're just basically trying to like oh there's another hole in the dike let me put my finger in this one up water's coming out of this one let me get my finger in this one and it never ends yeah you're right it did running up the Sand Dune that's a good that's a good analogy the first seems like it's like a million-mile high Sand Dune yeah and it is I think it is it's always looked DC is always been divisive politics have always created the division the Press is always been by

in one way or another these things aren't new but and we always tend to think it's the worst we've ever seen it let the Civil War was pretty bad that was pretty divisive so yeah so when you have a politician like I think it was Joe Biden right at that said that the president is the most you know racist you know president we've ever had and you think well I don't know the president's that owned slaves brought exactly 12 president's own slaves I think that might have been a problem but you know so so and or the race relations are the worst they've ever been and you think yeah how about the 60s that was pretty bad right and in the Civil War and I think so every every time is good yeah I know and and and but I guess my point being is it you know you can you can fall into that trap where you think it's as bad as it's ever been it's I think it's fair to say that it is more polarizing now than in recent times and how do we walk it back how do we dial it down a little bit and how do we actually focus on what's important for General populations a lot of big issues with

be solving right I mean but look at the insanity of when we talk about Healthcare right right it's like oh it's got to be all this or it's got to be all that nobody's over in the middle saying well you know you could take a little bit of this and that and again how do you walk that back at its way above my pay grade and I hunkered down in Idaho and I'd go fishing and I don't think about it that's a good way to do about see any solution that anybody has it makes any sense and that's one of the things that terrifies me and I don't want to just step away I don't want to be that guy that moves to fucking Idaho New Zealand's they're great people oh yeah yeah yeah but I mean it's like what we do in Edmonton UFC oh and the show yes I'm sure you did River Creek Casino yeah it's um

I just feel like there's no real General solution nor is there a map of a potential solution and unless I mean and if we get a democrat in the white house it's not going to end remember when Obama was in office they were mad that he wore a gray suit or a tan suit and suit making fun of his suit the fuck do you care this is this is all you care about it's like this polarization the Fox News versus MSNBC polarization that doesn't help anybody and it's fuck it's so bananas that if you have a podcast like mine and I have a left wing person on I'm a sellout if I have a right wing person on I'm a Nazi yeah and it just goes back and forth you can't even talk to people anymore which is now if it does it comes down to you can't have policy differences anymore right it's got to be some personal animus that you've got towards that other individual which is its again is

is horseshit you can have policy differences with with people and that doesn't make you a bad person it doesn't make you a you know the sure there's other races at the corset freaking races out there right but that's we've lost them the meaning of the term when you just start hurling that around at anybody you disagree with right or when people say well if you like Trump you're a racist right well congratulations you're probably driving those people to definitely vote for him in 2020 that is absolutely fact that's one thing that I completely agree with you on that I think that this idea that everybody who supports Trump is racist it makes those people so angry that they just want to go okay I'm gonna well you're obviously nuts I can't I can't be on your side you people are crazy want to open up the borders and you want to take all the money from the everybody that's a hard-working American give it to all the poor people and fuck you and it's like the arguments just gets so confused yeah I know I don't know where it is I mean if you think about who who might win

don't think Joe Biden's Gonna Last I think they're gonna eat him alive it's not good he's not gonna make it's going to be I think Bernie and Kamala Harris and Tulsi gabbard those are the ones only ones that makes Dulce make sense to me she's a veteran congresswoman for six years she seems incredibly honest and and to her morals and ethics are on point I like her she's my favorite but if the the left is going to have someone they're going to have to be able to deal with Trump's insults are going to be able to debate him and that's where they all fall apart because they are trying to use that old model of politics and he's not doing that he's a showman and I think what's happening is the pope they looked at the people that count in this in the primary or you know that's a completely different bag right then what goes on in the general and I think the people that are in the primary right now all those people are going to be voting in the primary there watching like these debates as an example are there just watching the daily Tweeter Twitter feed from these

the candidates and their thinking can I see this person debating Trump right right and so the not only are the policies that these candidates are spouting are moving further and further to the left which is going to make it harder when the general election comes to shift to the center that can be able to do it right that Center is now shifted further to the left if they even make the effort to get back there but you know you're getting sort of like the worst instincts coming out from these candidates because they think well I got a show that I can throw a firebomb here because they're looking at me was you know can I debate Trump right and so you're going to you're going to get somebody who's not so I don't think Tulsi gabbard's going to make it because I think they're going to make that calculation I think that there you're probably going to look in there you can end up with with Harris or maybe Warren morons are going to make yeah I don't know that made it American things going to thank you would think so right yeah we think so Harvard actually touted her and some of their literature when they were talking about their diversity efforts over the years there's actually documents where Harvard was saying you know and we

Arjuna first Native American you know professor and thinking statistic I'm 200 times more African than she is Native American how about that basically Africa are you yeah I didn't know that 1.6% 1.6 percent from where we know 23andMe I did want to make this a place someone from that continent fucked one of my ancestors what if you find out it's South Africa though that it's not quite as yeah it's not quite as interesting but yeah well that's Dutch right yeah that's jab or board yeah yeah I haven't done that you know my daughter did it and I have not done that I had actually had a conversation the other day about this whole thing about the desire to know your ancestry and everything and my dad came over never talked about his background ever talk about his family CI dad you have with it and you don't keep his mouth shut but and so he never he never did

stated that interest right and so therefore I don't think I've ever been I've never just been that focused on it everything was in there that I knew was in there mostly Italian little bit of Irish but some weird shit like 1% Asian thought that was odd to and he's Scottish no whistle a Scottish floating around out there and I'd like to fuck your heart yeah we're gonna kill this that's right they get out and get out about yeah yeah I don't know I don't know where it's all going but I do think that Warren could be viewed not I don't I don't like trouble Crush of it but I think she was I think the base looks at it and thinks yeah she could be a Firebrand how could they after that whole Native American thing she built her career on a lie they don't care that's good America does care yeah that's the problem America cares you can't look past that the same way you couldn't look past Hillary being a liar yeah Hillary tried to say that her name came from Edmund Hillary the guy who climbed Mount Everest meanwhile he climbed Mount Everest three years after she was born

but you know what he was still quite the character before so you know it was still throwing that name around yeah but more than three years yeah after she was born might have been seven years yeah I but you think it won't be I don't think I'll be Bernie I don't think you know why not wow God Democratic socialism well I tell you so much you go up to Vermont and look around for Mont and see what kind of job Bernie's done and how about Peter Budaj it's pretty good shape they fucking hate him in his own City judge it mayor Pete they're pissed at him and South Bend it would have came with ticket with the blast you that'd be at our level where they are all ticket right there there's no one person that stands out there's no one person that like stands out as someone who's kind of win you know everyone is I who could this person make it that person make it and then there's people that want to challenge Trump which is hilarious well I think it's going to be even see we're going to lose a lot of these folks after this next round of debates which I guess tonight the more night is I think this a it's not an A and A B card but there's two nights of two nights of the minutes because there's so many of them Bow Wow Bow Wow

did you see the Pacquiao fight yes yeah I was in great man I gotta tell you I have drops Thurman in the first round they don't term is a beast to man that's crazy it was it was that was a great moment and then it was a it was an interesting fight and I thought I wasn't quite sure at the end where I was going to go but I liked I've watched patio over the years and I did there was kind of that typical you know you get older and you kind of rooting for the old guy he's incredible 40 years old he is the oldest man to ever capture the Welterweight Title yeah and particularly when you consider those lighter weight classes like Foreman won the heavyweight title at 46 which was crazy yeah but Pacquiao winning the Welterweight Title at 40s fucking banana their ass off and just it was it was a it was a good good fight I really enjoyed that I was so the first time I really watched a fight that I really enjoyed right beginning to end and I was with some folks who were not for Pacquiao and I kept looking I'm thinking how do you not like the easy old guys been doing this forever he's a senator yeah I know I think about that

Crews going back to work on a budget issues in the Philippines after the fight that's great yeah yeah I think he made 10 million on that I think yeah yeah yeah good for him yeah good for Keith Thurman to we made two and a half it's got some chatter Now Keith holla at your boy I love it Mayweather was in the audience yeah well that would be fantastic if they me Now's the Time to do it if Mayweather really wants to do it but met with them I don't watch that fight and go from yeah because the first time they fought Pacquiao had a blown-out shoulder and that a lot of people are angry there was actually even talk of a class action lawsuit against Pacquiao but after the fight because people had bet on him and he knew his shoulder was fucked up go he'd heard it in training and try think he got a cortisone shot and said I'm just going to try to fight on and then he wound up getting shoulder surgery and then from then on after rehab looks fantastic that's really interesting though the concept of could you could you push through a class action lawsuit with an athlete who is in that position and I mean yeah where does that go I mean

you're playing hurt I mean you're in the NFL and you're playing hurt right do you have any obligation now I mean I know it's interesting well UFC fighters fight hurt all the time I know for a fact guys fight with blown out ACLS and torn hamstrings and they just listen they get to that point they think I can still win and some of them still win come are loose mon won the title with a broken foot he broke his foot in training and he was literally on crutches the week of the fight and then the guy gets to the fight and he's such a fucking animal so tough that he fought like there was nothing wrong with him and then afterwards revealed that he had broken his foot it's fucking bananas the mental toughness that you have to have to be able to do that for a living and then you and when you lose to somebody with a broken foot yeah let's yeah yes dominated dominated Tyron Woodley which is even crazier but then would lie when to that fight injured as well I mean it's just the nature of the Beast if your job is to hurt people and break their bodies you're going to have to practice breaking bodies

along the way and you can have to practice it with people that are trying to break your body and occasionally they succeed yeah yeah rough business yeah come come to an event I'd like actually I would like to do that like what an Anaheim in a couple of weeks you should come to that one it's a big one Daniel Cormier is fighting steep a miocic okay for the heavyweight title and a couple of weeks yep Nate Diaz is fighting Anthony Pettis that's a crazy fight and Paolo Costa is fighting yoel Romero the two or three rather epic fight somewhere in France in Anaheim graying no one gets injured yeah you know what I could bring scooter scooter like Rings yeah he likes that come on down man yeah set it up you know what I'll follow up on I will do all right and tell me when you show comes out so I could let the let the people know maybe you can come back on again whenever it actually if you wouldn't mind I once they give me the go-ahead because apparently I'm prescribing I'm talking about it when they give me the go-ahead you won't be to get it to shut up all right just keep talking well thank you Joe do that thank you sir thank you good times all right bye everybody

thank you folks thanks for tuning into the show and thank you to our sponsors thank you to movement watches sunglasses and accessories they got dope shit and doesn't cost a ton of money they sold over 2.5 million products across more than a hundred and sixty countries in their collections are always expanding and they have free shipping and free returns get 15% off with free shipping and free returns by going to MVM t.com Rogan Cy movement keeps growing check out their expanding collection go to MVM t.com Rogan join the movement and thank you also to LegalZoom legalzoom.com is an awesome resource for all sorts of legal things and particularly during National make a will month at legalzoom.com you can get that last will or living trust settled up and you can join more than 1 million people that have counted on LegalZoom

a will or living trust before another summer passes by go to legalzoom.com and use the code Rogan at checkout for special savings that's legalzoom.com where life meets legal and we are also brought to you by the mother fucking cash app thank you to the cash app please download the cash app from the app store or the Google Play Market and when you do download it use the referral code Joe Rogan all one word you will get $10 not five but ten dollars in the cash app will also send ten dollars to support our good friend Justin Ren's fight for the Forgotten charity they're building Wells for the pygmies in the Congo and forth again for the entire month of July which is only got two more days left use the promo code Joe Rogan and you get 10 bucks and ten dollars goes to an awesome charity thank you my friends thanks for tuning in much love to you all and big kiss