#1021 - Russell Brand

Oct 5, 2017

Russell Brand is an English comedian, actor, radio host, author, and activist. His new book "Recovery: Freedom From Our Addictions" is available now, and his podcast called "Under The Skin" is available on iTunes.

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Hello friends what's going on at the Mirage in

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Las Vegas tomorrow Friday the 6th with the Great and Powerful Ian Edwards all the money goes to the Las Vegas victims fund from the horrific events of this past weekend all the money goes to them then on October the 28th I'm in San Francisco at the Masonic Theatres November 3rd the theater at Madison Square Garden in New York City the 17th I'm at the belko theater in Denver Colorado

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First shows almost sold out some tickets available for the second show and then the next item in Phoenix at the Commerce see all the tickets are available for all these shows at Joe Rogan dotnet forward slash tour oh yeah and Vegas Vegas motherfucker this weekend this Friday I already said that yeah say it again New Year's Eve is going to be at The Wiltern and that is the will turn

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theater in Los Angeles again me and Ian Edwards second show is sold out for show still has some tickets though okay all right this episode the podcast is brought to you by on it on it is a total human optimization company we specialize in functional strength

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we did it my guest today is the Great and Powerful Russell Brand and we had a great fucking time so please give it up for Russell Brand The Joe Rogan Experience trained by day Joe Rogan podcast by night

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I'ma do what you're doing what you doing over there man what is this well actually I was thinking about making sure that I'm in a position mentally and spiritually to talk openly and clearly connect but you doing it with fists on interesting I'm gonna be talk openly but you're going to be strong about it it's not like this there's this thing that the meditation thing where you just gently touching your fingers together yeah Roy I suppose they're now looking to be embodied as well tense

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and you're like a hybrid yeah that's right that's what we've got become these days yeah a little bit of both little bit of spiritual little bit of warrior the whole thing we gotta survive in this world yeah you know yeah so you can't be all the theory or it can't be or it can't all be right in the Consciousness yeah there was a never get anything done mmm right you'll just be constantly dealing with other people's wants and wishes and you know unless you going to make the decision to be one of those cave people

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unless you're because that's not what I think about that like this put on robes meditate only that only live in the Consciousness but given my extreme levels of attachment I've experienced over the years to physical things I don't think that's my path you know I'm here I'm in the world I'm selling books I'm having a baby hearing about what people think about me and wondering if I'm going to be in a film I'm dealing with the world yeah being a man in the world being the type of man I am it's not like I know I just realized myself off

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in a cave well there's a certain amount of attraction that we think we all have to this idea like hey man I'm just going to get away from it all but the problem is you it's going on whether you like it or not it's happening it's like even if you're not there yeah so you should probably be there just to go what is this - what is this even in Christiania a Christ says in the world but not of it yeah so like trying not to be defined and determined by other people's opinions of you the systems and structures that set up around you

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actually if you question those systems and structures and think well I don't trust that system I don't agree with that so how you don't want to be defined by that but the fact is we are here and I think there are certain people you know that do have a monastic tendency that should be meditating that aren't equipped for the material world and one of the great things that makes me sad about our times there's if you don't have economic and productive value then you are nobody you know there are some people that don't know how to Resource themselves you found a way of turning yourself

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to an economy of creating a kingdom I found my own way of life all right I can make my mental illness work for me people pay me money this crazy but not everyone gets those kind of breaks or has that kind of skill set yeah I mean obviously there's some people that really do thrive on that monastic Life Style there's have you ever seen this a vice documentary on this guy his name is hinemoa oh he lives in the Believers the eastern part of the of

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aska he's in this this Arctic region it's there's a vice piece called hind mozarta could Venture that's it Arctic Refuge hi Mo HEI mo heimeau's hi MO korth is his name and this guy is a variant he lives in the elastic Arctic National Wildlife Refuge hmm a hundred miles from the nearest human and he lives there with his wife and he lives in this little log house that he's sort of built himself and he

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drives up there it's very strange because we're attracted to these people like like to just go okay what do you do all day man like what's your life like and do do do you miss people he has like a vcr and he plays old movies and it's a fascinating thing because I think when you watch someone like that you see you always run it through your head like could I live like that like is this is this guy happier he says he is mean he says that the the hunter-gatherer lifestyle that

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he lives is like uniquely attractive to people and uniquely satisfying and it's something that we don't get in our everyday world so we're never like completely even whereas he is just running around fishing and hunting caribou and stuff with fitting him with someone's eye else's idea of what life should be the system under within which most of us operate is not this isn't what I would do if rent but if I had this free start you know I don't mean just personally mirror

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so I mean amphora logically yeah we're designed to be nabad nomadic tribes people when my podcast I do as a suggestion by you I had on as a guest you Val know Harare he wrote that book sapiens and he does a lot of anthropology stuff and says about like that that were designed to live in tribes of about 75 200 people at least that's what chimpanzees do when they get bigger there's normally a conflict and a separation in a split in that nomadic tribes would follow

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whoa the food sources that were available to them so in a way if you can replicate that or get close to that in some way of your own in your own life it would make sense that it would make you happy and we've like when you're saying about the guy is a hundred miles away from the nearest person I thought people there's people that live in Suburbia that mentally are a hundred miles away from the nearest person that you just really your life is you sit in front of a screen you don't connect with people you've not spoke to people for days you know I think about this when people make these desperate attempts to connect

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through dog in is a thing in my country where people meet up in Les buys and just have an anima sex masturbating in public dogging it's a uniquely British phenomena dog barking I've never heard of this well welcome welcome to Britain talking is people got a lay-by is quite layered buyers and it's like could be sort of suburban it's a bit like swinging you know but it's like you pull up in a car with you know this isn't this is I've never done this I'll just clarify you pull up in a car with a partner I could be you know I think it's a kind of hetrosexual thing or how much that you can do it wherever you know wherever your persuasion is this particular

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as of particular people and you know the lights go on and people jerk off and you know you can have sex right and something in these are desperate attempts to find some connection to Nature to sort of drop anchor and hit your Primal self to get into who you are because you wake up and you've got to do your job and you've got a screen in front of you and you're a consumer and you're not living in the world anymore you want some visceral experience one of things I get from this in your pocket he's like oh you're a person that's questing after with the whether it's the archery or the DMT

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looking for what is it that we are meant to be as humans and I'm doing that in my own way having unfortunately written off substances because my stupid stupid mistakes in my 20s I can't go into the DMT iOS towards much as I would like to and like I want to find out how is it that I be me in this world and yeah I don't think it is through isolationism I don't think it's like right I'm going to try and get an island and fuck this on and I'm not going to participate I think it's like write what you know we are nature we created this this is a form of nature our civilization

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Asians our manifestations but is it the best we can do can we change it can we pull back from what seems more than ever like some kind of Apocalypse with you know your current president no disrespect and with our country breakfast sort of like a weird time of fracture and the manifestation of ugliness stuff bubbling up fully like dark unconscious matter bubbling up man I was in the airport traveling to here and I was in New York and not just the people that are working the lines when you put your cases through that people felt seem heavy and low and like because if you

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British Donald Trump just something that you know you kind of make jokes about you hope that there isn't going to be a nuclear war but he seems like a sort of a comic figure but here I sort of Centaur this pain now I know there's a lot of people that obviously like him enough to have made him president United States but I think it even in those cases he speaks to a particular rage something that wasn't being addressed the failure of neoliberalism the lies of the last 40 Years of a kind of politics that was just about management and not about giving people truth I don't know Joe I like you know like our individual Journeys how can our

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dividual Journeys inform our social and tribal Journeys now National Journeys and is there even hope anymore for such a thing as United States of America or Great Britain or should we start looking at smaller projects because you know if the United States of America and Great Britain lead to colonialism Mass capitalism consumerism ecological meltdown if that's what you believe in then maybe we need to look at breaking down some of these great institutions yeah I wonder if what's going on is that our biology and what we've been sort of programmed to for

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thousands of years of living these tribal existences where we in these tribal existence we had these small groups of fifty to sixty or a hundred people plus that this is the new thing and that part of our chaos is are trying to adapt to the new thing it's almost inevitable we've created this incredible way where we can get food to people so more people had babies more people stayed in these areas where they're not growing food and then you have your dealing with you

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massive numbers of people you know La 20 plus million and we're trying to figure out like how do we get along how do all these different ideologies coincide how do we how do we cooperate how do we how do we figure out what to do with all our waste I don't figure out what to do with what we're doing to the environment you know how do we figure out who's right you know is it is the Doom and Gloom people correct or the we're going to be okay people correct you know and what's the what's the right attitude to take about this many

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of those significant movements that you're talking about agriculture and industrialization and urbanization agriculture obviously meaning food available on mass yeah industrialization products available on mass urbanization people living together on mass none of these things are good for the people on mass they're good for a select strata of people that primarily benefit you know like the app they say that the average dire of

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human being got worse after agriculture before that varied diet people it loads of stuff after I culture your own potatoes now peasant your own rice now peasants you know so like I think each of these movements are to benefit a particular aspect of the system a particular class of particular strata particular economic class and you know mean you ain't doing bad we have relatively near the top but we're not the engineer's of it there are corporations and Elites to use that very popular word these days that benefit from

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being like this I don't when you're saying is there a way that we can all coalesce and get along in urban conurbations of 20 million people know because the powers to centralize don't tell me it's not break down mostly we are getting along maybe mostly most mostly we are getting along in these weird groups and even with our whatever static that we have with each other you with the weird weirdness of it all the diffusion of responsibility that comes these gigantic groups and you see things happening just get away from them that we still for the most part of getting along

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long in this weird new world I think you'll right in a sense Joe like I'm not I'm not a demon Gloom guy I think human beings really really beautiful and Brilliant and like I don't feel like oh God this is a mess what I think is that we're trying to inhabit systems that are not designed for us to live within and I think that yeah people are getting on but I also think don't you think there's a lot of tension in cities that everyone's one right turn or one traffic light away from getting out of their cars smashing someone in the face you can look and feel it bubbling either and that in

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the feeling I had in the airport is that the people that were working there were under undue stress now this is just one anecdote but I feel like we're being forced to live on a particular aspect of our Consciousness a particular bandwidth of where we kind of a bit frightened the foot little bit too much desire and I'm talking about most people we again I'm not poor no more so I'm able to create a blood Money creates distance isn't it - like you can fuck off problems I'm getting in a nice car and I'm out of here but like I remember the feeling and

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a lot of people are living like that with a tensions up in their face and so yes I agree that people do muddle along and that's I think shows you that we're not as in a darwinistic model or some of the ideas derived from Darwinism rather like the selfish Gene and the Richard Dawkins idea that people just want to survive and we just want to kill him fucking you know with this is what propels US forward I think know we are coat we are Cooperative collaborative artistic imaginative beautiful people but we've created systems around the worst aspects of our nature greed

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selfishness this is what capitalism and consumerism thrive on and there's so all-encompassing our culture's our domed by them and we can't see beyond them we exist within him and I feel like that if we were to break down those kind of systems live in smaller assemblies smaller groups where power is as close to the people that it affects as possible where people would vote on what this is how we want to use our resources this is where how we want to run our street our Hospital our prisons our schools our systems this is how we want them to run

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then things which really really slow down but man what's the rush you know things would slow down get a lot slower but I think that people would be empowered and you wouldn't have resources and power filtered to a small group of people and I think you're definitely right I think she probably started called got a good idea about how to run it and how to keep the resources in the community I think that also this discontent that we have is a sign that people being upset with how this is and the momentum of the way things have sort of established themselves today that we

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this is like what we need this is the momentum and the the motivation that we need to try to improve upon things I think we're uniquely qualified to do that today because we're talking about it so you could be the Doom and Gloom guy today I'll be rose-colored glasses so I think that this tension that we have in this even like a guy like Donald Trump or brexit I think the good thing about those things is that people are looking at what they don't like about the way we were running the world what they don't like about our culture and they're getting upset about it and hopefully will

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sort it out that way and that being completely content with everything and everybody just sitting on the couch and smiling all day it doesn't lead to necessarily lead to progress I think we're more informed now than we've ever been before so I would hope that with our ability to communicate and being more informed now that we have the potential to move towards a better Society I agree with that might but I also think that we the what's important in the world is who has power power being the ability to affect change

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one of those people to act like I'm not like baffled by what happened with Trump I feel oh there's an indication that a good many people feel extremely angry and disenfranchised the same as bricks in our country and I recognize and I understand it similarly I don't think oh wouldn't everything be Zip-a-Dee-Doo-Dah if Hillary Clinton was President of the United States that was with the way stuff was going that's what the previous 30 years has been like in your country my country managerial politicians with no vision we've seen the failure of recents of that they've kind of promises that

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are offered by and administration's recently I think that what Trump is what brexit is is a big fuck you to the system like we want something different but and I'm for me in a way these things are good because I believe the people that feel those things are right and I would like to see more power delivered to Ordinary People genuine change happening but I think it won't happen unless you sort of look at well what where is the power of really the power really is with people that this system works for a sort of a particular corporate Elite

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ticklish straw or of I don't know politicians and bureaucrats and and I've hope that what these sort of cataclysms of recent recent years lead to is Devolution of power new systems because even in the time that I've been in your country on this trip Joe you know they've been that mad sort of Massacre that you know that's it's all for me is that this tells me that this is a sick Society not you know I'm not oh and Britain's wonderful of course you know we went around plundering the world with crazy

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I see we've got enough problems of our own but like for me what is causing this why is this happening you know for me I don't see it in isolation I don't believe in Lone Wolf I think the system is coughing up these mad events and there are patterned and there's things that we can read and there are things that we can change to improve it well he's certainly a part of the guy that was that shooter is certainly a part of our society right so if we have a Sikh culture you know I mean there's there's evidence of it I mean is it not is not a completely sick culture I mean we don't we're not all dying right we're not all we don't all have this disease

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he's but some of us most certainly do so this thing that you're saying like that people looked at Donald Trump as a big fuck you to system the tipping over the apple cart I think that's absolutely what people are hoping for and then there's a bunch of people that just love saying fuck you hmm there's a bunch of people that went fuck you is flying around yeah fuck you they just get in it fuck you to fuck you and then you're seeing a lot of that with Donald Trump supporters as well you're seeing people that they're looking for some excitement they looking for some fun you know you're looking you're seeing people that enjoy chaos

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you know maybe they're trapped in cubicles and they're just completely frustrated by this fucking grind this day-to-day grind like literally being their soul being ground down on a cheesegrater everyday being forced to stay under these fluorescent lights and it's fucking small little box dealing with human resources in the corporate environment and they're going fucking crazy and anything that happens that the tips that over it's all Fight Club right there just looking to get punched in the face they looking to go crazy then

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there's a lot of that as well you know but I think

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this chaos the worst Parts about it there's no good to write there's no good to mass shootings but what comes out of all these things is the discussions and the intense realization that we have real problems we have real problems with the way we're communicating with each other and I don't necessarily know if the solution I mean it would certainly be a solution for those involved if you get a hundred amazing people and everybody just starts a co-op in Maine somewhere yeah be great for those involved but for for all of us I mean even while that I mean it's almost like that

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lifestyle we're talking about if everybody just isolates it's all going on around you if you put your phone in a drawer and never use it again and you stay off the grid and you get your water from a spring all those people out there still drinking water with antidepressants in it and you know there's there's a bunch of fucking smog the people have to deal with is a bunch of problems with hurricanes now because the waters warmer there's it's inevitable it's inevitable that this is all I mean you can decide hey man I only have a hundred years in this planet fuck this I'm just going to ride this out but if you do

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you make a kid and you have and I've got a bunch of them I mean you what's going to happen to them you know what we have to think about what happens with them as well we're all this Global Community really yes we are and that's why I don't go for the hedonic lifestyle of our fuck it I've got a century right let's line up some blow jobs I tried that route and like light up Slow Joe lets go Rye Century worth of blowjobs great way of putting it let's line up some blowjob ice cream here blow job there and off to the right

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you know it yeah you know like because I like you believe in the possibility of change and I've been like in mention it again I start a podcast cause you said you know by podcast and it's a good fun like what I do on mine is I get like because I'm doing this University degree religion in global politics in fact this thing happened what happened to me really is I hit 40 and I thought right now I know a bunch of things aren't going to work the ice cream the blowjobs the attention the privilege heroin crack all these things are control cough is not working I can't control

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tell him I've got to find a way through this and oddly peculiarly it's a sort of a personal version of spirituality that's what I've found William Blake The Great English poets is each artist must find his own religion we have to find our own way what works for you is not going to be the same as what works for me you know there are ways that we are collective but there are ways where we are individuals so I thought well I'll go and have to educate myself I'm gonna have to do things that mean something to me a big part of that was like right me and doing you know in my own small fragile brittle way

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alien Jiu-Jitsu girl I never done stuff like that before so going like and don't write leaving your body being there and go to Genesis gym in my life I give them a drop because all these guys are such big fans of your show you know and I go down I do sessions with Chris that titanium skeleton of a man that black belt with me Happy can cause pain in ways that's what how is he even doing that and like when I try to do the stuff back it doesn't work or puts me in my body in a different way learning the history of the ideas that are in religion the way that the diff the distinction between politics and religion is and sort of and

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imaginary distinction when people talk about religious violence versus secular violence they sang their violence is irrational and our violence is okay I've learned some amazing stuff in the last few years and what and as a result of that the kind of guess I get on my podcast like this guy can't Ross mate you'd love him on yours actually he was a diplomat in the Foreign Service around the time of the weapons of mass destruction and 911 he believed in the system he's like eating it all he wanted was to work in the Foreign Service he knew they were lying while it was going on seems like our know this thing I

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evening is not true like he's being asked to participate in it he's come out of the foreign office and believes that no centralized power can never work we have to have devolved power assemblies anarchism is the word Anarchy doesn't mean chaos Anarchy means devolve power to the smallest possible groups that there's no power between you and I and Jamie that we are equal in here and we should run the space according to what all of us think as a group that hospitals schools or institutions community

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should be run on a democratic basis you don't need like in a minimum eyes the amount of centralized Authority we need roads to be running needs to be some secure in all those companies base will be minimized where possible that's what this guy came away with and he explained it real world to me and what I like the increasingly what I think is that when you talk about that make the cheese grater on the soul that's the that's the phenomena of the West you know that's what people in our countries are going through his alienation is talked about like in one of the things that are never gets taught me about Marxism that

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Marxist theory of the way that he criticized and broke down capitalism how I operate he wasn't just talking about the economics about Marx was a great Economist he goes capitalism will lead to individuals feeling worthless and meaningless because they'll just be cogs in the machine it will break people's spirits and that is what's happened because people don't want not the only thing that's happened go on it's also created incredible technology and medical Innovation all sorts of different ways that we can make the world easier do you think we could keep those things without the cheese

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great a soul mate because I think we could I think we could I think the stuff now we could progress with it we could have different Farrah ways of doing that and people like I've been people kill that conversation too early because there's yeah you know because it working for the enough people yeah the throwing out the baby with the bathwater I think so yeah that's what the the whole thing of Marxism is the abandonment of capitalism and so let's go this way but you know you look at what happened when people adopted Marxism and left the led to the death of millions and millions of people as has capitalism in a lot of places well yeah but know what that is but it's not reported in the same

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I am not saying that we all want to live in communist China you know the Soviet Union or China terrible terrible things happen there but that's what we always we always revert to you know we say well is there not is it not possible that we could for a start they didn't do it properly they ignored it that's what everybody says but no one's ever done it properly I mean we have more freedom today human beings have more freedom more freedom to behave more freedom to communicate more freedom to excel with this capitalist society that we're criticizing today than any human beings that have ever lived ever there's a lot of negative about it a hundred

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two percent but it's also there's a lot of benefits and positive about it there are a lot of soulless people that are just counting numbers and throwing them on a hard drive somewhere and buying Yachts that's that's true to that doesn't mean we shouldn't continue to evolve in a spy I don't think evolution is finished I know there's loads of good things about capitalism buffing this carry on it see what we can do is could we be doing this better I believe that we could I believe that this is taken as about as far as it would go because of certain ecologically imperatives and in the spiritual thing that you definitely mentioned that it's destroying the souls of a

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people and it's not necessary when is that you know the wall we were promised in the 50s and the technological Revolution will mean you'll work I have an hour a day you know like I've no one delivered on that people just went out I actually carry on fucking working and will siphon the prophet uphill and we could have Leisure based societies but I think that as long as there is a form of centralized power people at the center of that power will not share it I think you have to go all right this community is going to be run by those people this community is going to be run by those people and

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it also solves a lot of the other problems that are defining our times of people seem to want different things some people want to say absolutely no homosexuality some people say we want Total sexual Freedom some people want we want to live in a what would be called a religious extreme way some people say I fist well that can't exist under one banner and the problem of people saying no homosexuality as they're they're deciding about Freedom the other people's freedoms to to exist for other people's freedoms to behave and to express themselves the way

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they want to and the real problem with that is a lot of the people that want to control other people's freedom they really the reason why they're doing is they're trying to suppress their own urges and do some can't be right one of the things I'm most interested in is how much of our activity is unconscious activity so much we're doing things we don't know why we're doing it the book here that I'm promoting recovery I've written this book is my version of 12-step read some of it last night you're in it yeah the 12 steps is a journey from unconsciousness to Consciousness that's where essentially is you done

► 00:34:49

seriously pursue pleasure you unconsciously pursue patterns because you don't know you're doing it if you're a smackhead or a crackhead like me eventually it gets you into such trouble you have to address it but most people hover along on the cheese grater level lives of quiet desperation never realizing I'm going to minute it is possible to be happy it is possible to be contented move towards nature you are yourself doing it you're going to write this is what I'm good at this one doing a note the way you run your life I don't you don't want no one telling you what to do you don't want to compromise you want to

► 00:35:19

all of this fascinating stuff and fulfill yourself you don't want a bit like so you've created a road for yourself to do that but not everybody can and more people could and I think they'll always be resistance they'll always be corruption but it's in me like I don't I shouldn't spend another second condemning Donald Trump because I've gotten our soul in me I like I'm a greedy person that wants attention and wants people to love me and buy my book and take care of my interest but your introspective thinking has led you to stop that path I mean that's that's essentially you

► 00:35:49

you you saw the flaws and hedonistic behavior and you hit the pause button and you thinking about that's very attractive to people because we all see that in ourselves you know and when you talk about like what what I do and what I've done the most important thing that I've ever done is surround myself with people that I love I got a really good group of friends and interesting people and that that leads to more like they find more interesting people it branches out and spreads out and then people listening to this they become like minded they

► 00:36:19

sue their happiness they pursue their their actual desires what interests them like what what what what they would like to do for their for their career for their life for their their craft what do you enjoy like find that thing surround yourself with like-minded people and I think we all get fuel from the people that were around and it's one of the most underrated aspects of being a person in a community is if you're around a bunch of ambitious people who are creative or oh

► 00:36:49

open-minded and honest you are inspired by that and you seek to have like like-minded thoughts yeah you're right bad I think that's another one in the color of the against column for disappearing into the cave and being a Hermit or a monk or whatever because I heard someone say we exist in dialectic which means we exist in relationship and conversation with one another who are you without other people you're nobody in an aluminium capsule floating through space what is your personality matter your nothing you know

► 00:37:19

you're right about that that we exist in these relationships with one another and I suppose what I have sought out is to connect with people on the level of the damage on the level of the wound on the level of the vulnerability knowing a pessimistic that's you know ring ourselves out into the gutter way no that's recognized that we are flawed but that together we can create supportive compassionate loving communities and for me the starting point for that is a life that is predicated on spirituality as opposed to

► 00:37:49

serialism yeah predicated on what my Consciousness does when I stop thinking what my Consciousness Stars when I meditate now I don't have the advantage of the DMT experience in the iOS got fascinated by it listen to it until she tried Kundalini you know because you do that well if you ever had any sort of psychedelic experience through doing Kundalini because the people that I know that are really into it they say that they can achieve people that I know that have done DMT I'll say they can achieve the same sort of States wow with Kundalini well then

► 00:38:19

doing it well Kundalini is one of the things I believe in this particular tattoo at my finger by Mark Mahoney of Shamrock Tattoos Los Angeles he's the Kundalini serpent as drawn by Carl Jung one of the great early figures of psychoanalysis that the fire in the belly the animal energy of survival the energy of creativity the serpent energy the reptile energy that's deep in our DNA when we were lizards when we were creatures that crawled on our belly and lives in a steel can be coronated the serpent the snake within can become crowned it can be

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come Royal your animal desires can become Royal and I think that the Kundalini as I understand it is about harnessing those energies bringing it up I do like yoga and I have died do have pretty tripped-out experiences where I feel like oh my God I'm awake but I am not me I am not my thoughts I feel the sense of transcendence and only film retrospectively you know in the moment there's no me to register it's only after saying wow I lost myself there do you feel weird when you finger people with their finger because it's I don't come productive it does I don't think that sneaking

► 00:39:20

and to banish fingerings become a less significant part of my life finger is a very weird it seems so rude it was in the expression fingering it's a dirty business is not functional no like it there's no need for it in the adult World Cuba like it's not for a lot of people love it people ask for it I say do it yeah but that's not why I think your phone is Greek give it give them the snake and that reptile right open the chakras is this the right moment to tell you I dreamt about you last night she'll knowing it's a risk always

► 00:39:49

is to tell someone that you dreamt about them because it's once it's out there it's out there so and particularly you know check it out so we were in this dream we were in some sort of semi organic Forest type world but they had an industrial component somewhat Labyrinthian makers nothing's wrong like that is if you know like the Ewoks how they've made the most of the woods you know they've built little cups and stuff and maybe they have little I don't know if the walks have another couple thousand years maybe they have built Lily Walker trains I don't know what they would have done who knows

► 00:40:20

lovely cuddly little guys so anyway there was a sovereign is small industrial component to it we were somewhere within that world and we were doing Brazilian jiu-jitsu that's used the word rolling now there was a sort of this is how we know is a dream because there's a moment where I had you in side control now from that moment I moved towards choke and you did something we arched and flipped over very acrobatically and very elegantly I don't even know if it's an actual move or not it's very very beautiful and a for our right there this spur with going quite well this rolling but

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it seems that Joe Rogan is better at Brazilian jiu-jitsu the me but they're even in the dream world that seemed like something I had an understanding of well there's Jiu-Jitsu what's brilliant about it and what's interesting about it is that the more time you put into it the more you understand the moves the more moves you acquire the more moves you drill the better you get at it the more it's literally like a language and that you'll as your vocabulary increases and your ability to like even if your

► 00:41:19

is very broad if you don't talk a lot you'd probably have stumbling conversations right but if you get used to talking all the time and you're having a conversation with someone and the words kind of flow but if you're talking to someone and they're weird and they bark out things and they talk over you it's awkward and herky-jerky much like Jiu-Jitsu Jiu-Jitsu is almost like a kinetic language but there's a puzzle that's being solved right and it's there's a problem right this person's the problem is this person is trying

► 00:41:49

and to apply all these different techniques whether they're chokes are all joint locks on you and you are trying to both defend that and then put it on your put yours on them it's beautiful I've heard you say before high pressure problem solving or something well MMA I always described as high level problem solving with dire physical consequences I a physical Point there's MMA is the most the most high level of all the problem solving because there's the consequences are so grave getting kicked in the head getting an elbow to knee

► 00:42:19

like those things are so Jiu-Jitsu I think is better for you for sure physically because the consequences are not nearly as Grave you get choked out your fine you get your arm you know you tap out if your lungs your you have as long as you're willing to tap out you have to be willing to tap you'll get through it okay and if you get injured you just get it fixed and take six months off you'll be back I like that connect language thing you said that really makes sense to me because I feel like when I'm doing it I'm like a person's going hello

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whoa yeah could you show me the way to the train Hodor Hodor Hodor yeah so so like and other people are like what sir I'll tell ya one thousand ways why I could get ugly yeah exactly do you watch Jiu-Jitsu it all online no I don't watch those but sometimes I look at videos of them Graces of something and yeah Marvel at their effortless capacities and Charisma you should watch just because you're enjoying it watch like current top of the food chain Jiu-Jitsu guys like half

► 00:43:19

Mendez you know watch some Marcelo Garcia watch some you know some of the young guys coming up Gary tonin it's fascinating to watch them apply these new strategies to this old language you know because that's really essentially what it is mean what you're seeing is these new approaches Jiu-Jitsu is this never ending thing I mean it really it just doesn't it doesn't like boxing although it's very complex and it doesn't seem as complex to someone on the outside but when you watch like a guy like Floyd

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I'd Mayweather or Sugar Ray Leonard or someone is like just a master at their craft would you you see how complex it truly is you see all the different the all the different nuances to it but it's still punching right it's just still to punching where's Jiu-Jitsu is this fucking tangle of bodies and possibilities and potential it has so many different ways to approach it this people that are chokers is people that are armlock guys as people that are they like to get you with their legs or triangle people and they all have their own little way of approaching this

► 00:44:19

so you've learned a few sort of grammatical pathways through that kinetic language and think right I'm going to master that particular area so watching videos online is like watching a video of Alan Watts talking you got okay okay Terence McKenna or yeah Timothy Leary or whoever it is that you think is fascinating you hear them talk and it develops new Pathways and possibilities for your own thinking and as one of the things I was going to say earlier that we went what I was thinking while we're having this conversation about the future and about possibilities and about civilization that

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at you with all due respect what you and I are doing both of us we're this is a very rudimentary way of trying to figure this out I think we're we're clubbing at it right you know and I think people are listening to this that will do a far better job than us in the future yeah and I think that that's important and I think that we're doing our best you know we're taking ourselves but when Henry Ford created the Model T he didn't intend it to race against a LaFerrari you know he didn't know what the fuck a LaFerrari was but if he didn't make that model T the LaFerrari wouldn't been

► 00:45:19

Isabel but you can't go back and go Henry Ford fucking suck dude drive this piece of shit with its leaf springs and stupid tires you know and then get in a 2017 Corvette ZR1 you go okay this is where it's at now it's like all these things have to be in place for the next evolution of it to advance and I think we're looking at today with our societies we're hoping that there's a solution out there we're home but there is a solution but it's goddamn slow just like all of elution it's

► 00:45:49

It's goddamn slow it's faster than single-celled organisms to a giraffe but it's still fucking slow and we are part of it all of us not just you and I but the people that are listening to this and the people that are having their own podcast their own conversations and doing TED talks and writing books we're all a part of thinking this out and these little pieces all fit together slowly but surely and create this Mosaic of ideas and potential and what we're experiencing now is just what we can experience

► 00:46:19

this realm like in this world with this life that we are currently stuck in and then some 150 years from now we'll be looking back at our stumbling conversation trying to figure out a way to engineer Society correctly and they'll have a much better way of doing it I think that's a very beautiful Progressive argument are gree with much of what you've said except to some degree Joe even things I've heard on this podcast say when you have Graham Hancock or a particular enjoyed it when you got the more sanctioned academic guidance

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guy on there and they like Graham felt like you know you know you bastard see other people that I'm such a rebel you know it's fascinating to see these people you know attacking him for his ideas and his research but now having less and less ground to stand on you know grams ideas have been more proven in the last 10 20 years and never before they case finding these new civilizations and finding this new evidence that human beings have existed on this continent far longer and that they're traveling all over the world for far longer in the

► 00:47:19

is probably quite a bit older than we thought that's right and so we don't therefore know that this idea of continual progression linear progression is the only one it is possible that when it comes to the realm of Consciousness ancient people knew something that we are struggling to understand that and I recognize that your Model T to Ferrari metaphor is a good one and actually speaking to young people now

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now I do feel that they're kind of more switched on jeez look at a baby with an iPad it seems like they know already and and it but what I feel is and this might just be my personal narcissism I like to think of myself as the Pinnacle of Consciousness that there isn't some other realm could even though God I want that DMT so bad like why are you afraid of that because it's not it's not a like it's not an intoxicant because I'm a 12-step guy and I'm a surprise stop all that 12-step that you're not going to follow that you're a fucking book about it

► 00:48:19

hope you're not gonna fuck them up you're not gonna fall back to my to addiction your this naughty this idea that you're going to fall apart and become a junkie again it's not going to happen that pop has that you can say that Joe but also an integral part of my recovery is the idea of surrender and I think that's an integral part of a lot of spiritual belief internal part of DMT that yeah I bet around I feel you man but like the to bypass the idea of my egoic authorship my egoic

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authority of I am Russell and this is what I believe in this is what I'm going to do I have surrendered to a way of life I have surrendered if I can find some people with 20 30 years in recovery clean time that go you're allowed to take the Mt I'm like just fucking hand me the pipe you don't need there is real life I saw their sanctioning well in a way yes and by the way you don't even need DMT now you don't need it but you seem like you want it yeah because I love the Transcendent I love it because I've know and I've always known that this experience of being

► 00:49:19

in a body in the conscious individualistic my don't remember if they can loads of acid when I was a kid as well I know that this is not all of it this is just we're just reading one bandwidth of data with our Century instruments that there is Limitless Consciousness and Limitless reality do you miss that asked experience yes I do I love it I love it is the concern that if you fell into it like whether it was mushrooms or whatever it is that if you fell into that experience again that it would lead you in a downward spiral

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of addiction in a sense it's that in a sense is that and the fact is as well that I've turned my life around or my life has been turned around by this program by this system and like you know the 1278 does have something in it that's quite what I want to say like I said little bit ascetic is a little you think like it's about the Nile right because but the reason that I've written this book was interpretation the 12 Steps excuse me is because I think is a masterpiece I think is a masterpiece at a time when people are struggling with ideologies at time and people are struggling with religion because the bad

► 00:50:19

about religion is so obvious the bigotry in the violence those things are so clear to us even though there are many many beautiful things about Islam and many beautiful things about Christianity is our Focus tends to turn on their bigotry and hatred that is present the or used out of those ideologies the 12-step is accessible to anybody and can be used as a code to unravel your connection to your own individual experience your own self centeredness your own self Obsession now this might not be a problem that you have that this might be the

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line that separates us me I'm self-obsessed and I have to add firstly like this is how it works one you admit there's something you want to change and like that could be I'm a smackhead pretty obvious then or you're a sex addict and that's a harder thing to admit because it can be rewarding if you're into adult human females in a culture like I was but if it ultimately leaves you lonely and unable to have a family and you feel like you're having a negative emotional effect on others and yourself then you need to admit it's a problem the second thing is could your life be better and they

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cause it could and the third thing is being willing to accept help from others and whether that's a community of am your understanding of a higher power now I happen to have I believe in God in the sense that I believe that there's Limitless Consciousness that my individual Consciousness is connected to something that I can't understand that no one can ever understand and again as I've heard on one of my own podcast as a matter of fact yanis varoufakis who live this political movement in Greece he said we will never know whether Consciousness preceded matter or matter proceeded Consciousness and in a way

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a it's irrelevant now because spirit this quality is here it's here and it's a big part of what human beings are and it isn't dealt with by consumerism and it isn't dealt with by contemporary politics people don't talk about love kindness togetherness that but these are the dominant things in our lives that's what's most important to me the people that I love like you said the connections with the people you have that become your reality but a political system that reduces you to a component of an economic machine is never going to fulfill you so what I have now believe is

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that by what I think this book can do is give people a guide to reach in their own spiritual truth because it's completely non-prescriptive it's like your version of God is going to be different from mine your personal inventory that you draw up will reveal the truths of the way you see the world and the problems you've made the communities that you belong to will support you and you can change your patterns you can make amends for your past you can continuously present and a vital part of this program is prayer and meditation continued connection to the moments you don't lose yourself in your path of the projectile

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sections of your future now whether or not that prohibits me from experimenting with psychedelics in the long term you know for me the jury's out because I do want to and Bill Wilson the guy who founded these fellowships was fascinated by acid and subsequent like even when he was so bad took a lot of acid and I think that guy was a prophet he was on a mission he was trying to discover what is truth what is reality the skirt discuss much in the 12-step program though is it because I think it's like most things it becomes Orthodox you know like most religions most systems

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in the end they become Orthodox and it does such a good job at helping with its primary purpose of stopping people being alcoholics stopping people being drug addicts that's such an amazing job and it's doing that job and it should continue to do that job what I feel like I wanted to do is extract the thing that I think is amazing about it and say oh my God anyone could use this you hear this again again from people have got long time Pro Clean in these programs everyone should work this program everyone should know what is the impact because your mom treated you that way or your dad did this or this sort of shit happen to you what score you were

► 00:53:49

used you're still carrying it in your Consciousness we touched on it a moment ago Joe if you want like I say this you don't choose between having a program and not having a program you choose between having a conscious program and an unconscious program if you're not working in a conscious program you are being worked by your unconscious program this is what I do if a man makes me feel intimidated this is what I do if a woman makes me feel like I'm important this is what I do if I have a bad day program program program the program of your class the program of your school your family your culture your time and this 12-step system

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can debug you from it and it's not anybody else telling you what to do because your own version of a higher power it's your own version of a truth except it's Guided by the idea become free connect to who you really are and become benevolent and loving to others you know what I think is it really important these sort of earlier about there's no political system or no no politicians that are talking about love and values and and caring and a sense of community I think that's the solution to what we're fearing about

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sit and Donald Trump and the rise of you know the just this tourney of the apple cart this this thing that people are seeing right now that they don't like and there's this this the hateful rhetoric that people are most disturbed about particularly with brexit right that's like the big thing that people really disturbed about is that it was fueled by this fear of the other yes right but isn't it possible that the when if people decide that that didn't work out whether it's brexit or Trump that the

► 00:55:19

cons to that would be the rise of this ideology the rise of someone who's going to talk about love and Community someone who's going to be genuine we don't have that person now but it doesn't mean that that person can exist and we've only had 45 different presidents we haven't had any every single version of what's possible for a human being to be interfacing with the entire civilization of the United States of America I think it's pretty clear that what that system delivers I think that those Power Systems are evolving in this direction I think

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at this is like if not the Pinnacle I think it's possible that there are better versions of a president but I think that systems that are at that centralized will always deliver in a quality I think it's impossible for them not to and I think that they should be evolved altered devolved in a sense broken down yeah but I do agree one of the things in that I think is positive about cataclysm in politics something like break the law when breaks it happened when Trump happened I felt this sort of I'm a bit I'm are you know I'm a trickster I'm a comic I live in Mischief I live in the madness that's just behind reality

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and I thought the in a way this is good not for the you know like people's lives would be negatively affected when we've seen the rise of divisive politics and like into sort of them quite old-fashioned ideas about sort of ethno-nationalism and that kind of stuff but the good thing is it precisely as you say Joe that it does open the conversation up for someone to say hold on a minute I think we've just left out love kindness Unity togetherness like these things perhaps people will be open to whereas I think if you know if we'd stayed in the European Union if you'd had Hillary Clinton as president things

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it's a bit more business as usual we're not forced with we're not staring into the face of Madness we're not forced to address things are going wrong you know I talked to my friends Sturgill deal Sturgill Simpson the musician he is brilliant musician and he was sent me this text message of a conversation that he had with dr. Rick Strassman dr. Rick Strassman as the guy out of the University of New Mexico ran those clinical tests on DMT wrote the book DMT The Spirit Molecule but he was

► 00:57:19

quoting when he was talking about the times that we live in and how fucked up everything is he was quoting this forget I think was a monk who said this that we are constantly in a fight between 49.9% and 50.1% good and evil and that they fluctuate back and forth and that we feel like we are just like a speck of dust because we are

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both a speck of dust and the most important thing in the world really because the the actions of one individual literally can influence the course of the human race the course of our civilization and that this period of flux is what creates growth and change and that the Tipping of the apple cart and that the positive thing about having someone like Donald Trump and I don't like Donald Trump more than I like Hillary Clinton I didn't like either one of them anyone Hillary Clinton represented to me was this lifelong politician who didn't

► 00:58:19

for gay marriage until 2013 which she was to me which he represented to me was an obvious magician someone who I could see them pulling the cards on their sleeve and I'm supposed to not pay attention yeah it's bullshit right yeah and what he represents is the ego unfettered in even for airing out with his crazy hair and a fat bellies and their hands and the whole deal it's just his chaos ego putting his name on buildings and they were realizing that both of these are terrible options

► 00:58:49

this system is a terrible system this week when we have what's essentially a popularity contest to see who controls nuclear weapons it's insane it's literally insane and that the only way this is going to change is by having this incredibly upsetting moment for everybody whether looking around going what the fuck is going on and then new ideas get introduced and I don't know what those new ideas are going to be or who's going to introduce them or how someone is going to

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come along with the next three years and challenge this current system in a way that's appealing not just to the right and to the left but maybe in some way to just human beings maybe in some way to human beings they realize like what's we're not going to get by In This World by enforcing right wing politics and ideas and and this sort of ideology or left-wing ideas and politics or ideology but freedom and love and community

► 00:59:48

and you too be free to practice your own level of conservatism on your own the idea that I don't want any gays and we'll have a little tribe or no gays are allowed that seems to me to be counterproductive and that seems to be the counter evolutionary you know all of that idea this any suppressing of people's individual right to express themselves sure I agree with almost everything you said there and I've got since I've been involved in Academia jinhwan the main changes I make notes but so like what yeah notes now I never I never would have dreamt to that when I was a younger man notes

► 01:00:19

excellent near the beginning you talked about this idea the Fitbit the percentile of you know good and evil the good news both of us now there's great quote by the rationale for sultanate's and the line between good and evil runs not between Creed's religions and Empires but through every human heart a nice quote for that isn't it quote now and I he's a personal theory that the reason that idolatry is bad like they becomes like an in most religions they don't worship individuals is precisely because they understand that don't make one individual have too much power even now he started

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see we know that God had skeletons in the closet great great Gandy this wonderful great hero of Bringing Down the British Empire bringing about Freedom you know although interestingly Gandhi said there's no point us kicking the British out of India and then replicating their systems this is a country of seventy Thousand Villages these 70,000 visitors religious or or could be autonomous run on their own craft or craft economies trade with one another only in excess so like he was trying to get like important ideas out there but like like your great civil rights leaders

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Comics mining for King these are men that had floor Malcolm X did prison time for unusual shit dr. King you know extramarital stuff people are not perfect they are great Heroes people Pioneers for our people so the we have to change this what I think is is that the the we can't have a popularity contest to decide who's in charge of nuclear weapons these kind of systems need to be devolved because it's mental we know that exact I agree with your analysis of Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump entirely I think that the reason that you

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you have a mad option like Donald Trump being successful as four people had enough of those cheap tricks and cards up sleeves and financial corruption so yeah that the Apple carts going over chaos to I agree is an important part of evolution we rest on chaos these patterns that we observe are just temporary I'll show the sort of cult leader and poetic figure then leader said we talk about civilization is if it's this great thing what is civilization a clearing in the forest

► 01:02:19

wrist you know for a moment we create our cities in the forest closes in has it again we're all these ancient civilization that Graham Hancock talks about so lucidly where are they in hell we're all caught up by the Amazon and I think great quote in Herman Melville's Moby-Dick that says Noah's flood is still happening we are the majority of the earth is still flooded in water these we are connected to these events we are out there in that chaos so I suppose gosh what I'm trying to

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stay here Joe is that it when we recognize that we are all flawed that we're all fallible we have to saw think we have to think how can we build systems that tend towards the better aspects of our nature not the worst aspects of our nature can we recognize that any politician in a position of power for too long will make mistakes will be flawed that power has to be spread out as much as possible and as close to the people that it affects as as is feasible yeah there's always going to be an issue with someone being able to acquire a

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nerd billion dollars like the Amazon Jeff Bezos guy like that that is going to corrupt people that's gonna is like why would you first of all why would you keep working why would you want that amount of money and what's your plan what's your endgame you trying to make the world a better place you're going to try to acquire more Brown boxes with your logo on them me what are you doing where's where's it going and it seems to me that there's a game right everybody plays this game some people play it for $10 an hour some people play for ten billion dollars a year and that once you

► 01:03:48

make ten billion dollars a year you want infinite growth you want 11 next year I would like to tell my stockholders that we have cause to celebrate and we have 20 percent increase in our bottom line is here and everybody's looking good let's go to Tahiti right and then like where what are you doing you can't this is not going to last you're not going to live forever like what what is the end game well there's no end game you're caught up in the current game and the current game they are literally capitalists are literally living in the moment because you're right

► 01:04:18

just put stockpiling shit yeah that they're not thinking about the overall objective you know Sky down looking from the you know looking from the heavens down on earth like what the fuck are we doing they're not thinking about the nor are they accepting that Limitless growth is literally impossible that we have finite resources on a finite planet and if you not for me and I think it's also you get caught up in the momentum of whatever you're doing you know whatever you're doing you just get caught up in it

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and you know you if you're doing something and you're trying to get better at it whether it's make better paintings or acquire more wealth like you these are quests and you try to get better at these quests you know and that's that's that's a real issue with human beings and I think it has evolutionary Roots I think it has roots in our our need and desire to make better structures and shelters to make better weapons to make a better civilization so that we can stay alive longer so that we can ensure that our children

► 01:05:18

will be alive longer I think there's roots in that that are sort of just sort of bastardized and twisted in this world of ideas where you're talking about like money and and and stocks and bonds and mutual funds and hedge funds and it's like Jesus like where it's almost like we have these ancient instincts for constant Improvement that just they these human reward systems get they just get corrupted

► 01:05:48

my theory on this idea is that we have biochemical drives as you've just described that compel us to move forward and to survive but we also have a culture that's continually stimulating fear and desire in order to cast us in a particular economic role that of consumer and the reason that I believe that this program and indeed this book are important is because it is a code to Awakening a code to becoming conscious

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once you a conscious you aren't beholden to the same systems so much of our behavior is a result of what we don't know about ourselves we are motivated we're trying to fulfill ourselves because there is that biochemical imperative to get more to survive which as an addict I experienced and have experience in extreme sex sex sex sex sex till there's no more getting out of my head till it's inconceivable that I could do that anymore about killing myself one in state s and power and Prestige the see the reason that I think

► 01:06:48

if this system works outside of addiction in its as it's currently recognized is I've had to work it in all sorts of ways once I got rid of drugs I got obsessed with sex once I get one size get a handle on sex I'll stop being obsessed with what other people think of me power Fame and money and what I'm continually recognizing is none of these things can be fulfilling if you're not connected to who you really are that can give you a moment then you're free to pursue your art or your creation of structures in a conscious way you're not doing it because you feel unconsciously a bit worthless or a bit

► 01:07:18

rapper like it might fulfill you it becomes pragmatic do you also feel that like less concentrating on yourself and less being self-obsessed is allowed you to have more open communication with other people and more healthy like like back and forth fulfilling communication with other people which literally makes you happier where as you thought that being obsessed with yourself and being obsessed with success and and adulation and or sex or whatever those other things were that you were obsessed with was going to fulfill those needs and they weren't

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but that community and bonding and it mean that's a big part of Jiu-Jitsu as well man that's a big part of it yeah big big big big part of Jiu-Jitsu is like we're a family when you're in there choking each other as weird as that sounds like there's a there's a bond between those people that are in those classes all over the world that are they're going they recognize this community in that as well as like it being an extreme Pursuit and as well as it being something that is developing your human potential you're also you're also creating

► 01:08:18

really intense community of like-minded people comedians feel that and I definitely feel that with you I feel that with the most comedians that come in here we I know what you we are the same thing in a lot of ways yes yes I think that's very important and in a way it's a return to what you were saying at the beginning of our conversation that there are certain anthropology core requirements that you know you need to feel like you're part of the tribe you need to feel connected to one another and in my very limited pop in there once a week experiences of

► 01:08:48

BJJ when I've liked done classes with other people instead of just the one on 1 million structure because he looks after me to know mean he's no delicate because he's brilliant but when it's with like other people that are a similar beginner level his moments of real intensity within it but afterwards our sense of fraternity and love and closeness and like some stuff that I'm not familiar with not used to being close to men in that kind of way and it's amazing and beautiful and probably very very natural and impute important and of side of my life

► 01:09:18

I didn't explore because I did download the myth of our time that you are an individual and you carve your own way in this world and what is what's important is your power your ability to affect change on others your ability to sleep with women the adulation of others and as I've got older and having experienced a degree of it I recognize it's not real it doesn't work and simple things connection and Community has become more and more valuable to me but it's an ongoing thing because if you are sick

► 01:09:48

at the percentages so close you know when I get involved recently in a campaign that was a got involved in a campaign to save our housing estate a couple of years back like these women ask me tell them our state's going to get turned into commercial Flats were all getting evicted we live here with our families I back their campaign I got them on the TV this corporate power backed down and it was amazing because like Ordinary People ordinary family be you know it was like the rebels be in the Empire it's like an amazing achievement of those people but my ego

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okay maíam the power I am the power fed back into it you know so like I see it as an ongoing thing but that my life now is how can I convey ideas that I think will help people in a way that is accessible how can I be useful and knowing that my pup my role in this is to make sure that I don't slip into the ago egomania again because I would love to be a cult leader on some days thinking thinking about it though this and being aware of it is one of the most important

► 01:10:48

steps because like we are all a work in progress mean there's no perfect person out there they don't exist we've already discussed this kind of Ad nauseam right I mean I'm a work in progress you're a work in progress I don't I never met anybody who wasn't and I never met anybody who doesn't vacillate at least a little bit later we're some days you're better than other days and those days where you're not as good you feel uncomfortable about it and those are the liquid lead to better days when you find yourself slipping those slipping moments are actually critical because they give you some self-awareness you realize why I fucked up you know I

► 01:11:18

yelled fuck you out my car window when I shouldn't have or whatever was you know well again this system is what provides you a way out of that like the you know the recovery system this 12-step system is that you wreck it like you would not rely on one person to be perfect you recognize everyone is fallible but together as a community we can start to have better objectives and in an instance like I fuck up all the time but there's step nine and step 10 are about making amends when you make a mistake like so I would like now I literally do this if there's a moment

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wash out fuck you at somebody or as you know I go shuffling back a day later this is this thing where I said fuck you that was wrong of me it must have affected your feelings were very sorry to find someone in traffic there you gotta find out your own fuck you at yeah I try and do it real quick we've gotta you've gotta go fast yeah he's maybe it's on a phone call or maybe it's in a shop or ever yeah I mean in a way is about I suppose becoming a benevolent force in this world if I tend towards that better 50.1% as opposed to the

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9 then I'm becoming an a Progressive Agent or a bourbon Evelyn agent as opposed to another person intoxicating the pool I think it's a microcosm of we were talking about earlier about Society itself is that one day in the future look what the way we behave today is light years past the way they behaved in during the Inquisition I mean and and in the future I imagine especially today because people have so much access to the way other people behaved we have so much

► 01:12:48

each data on just written words listening to people talk and podcasts and speeches and watching videos there's so much more data than there ever was available a hundred two hundred a thousand years ago that in the future we're going to have a much better way of communicating based on the learning and growth if we survive right and I think that's the same thing with you and I and everybody listening to this as a human being if you continue to grow and you don't fall into all these traps

► 01:13:18

as time goes on you will be a better version it's slow and it's fucking brutal and it's painful sometimes because it's just you feel like God you don't why don't I have my shit together you know I mean there's mean and I was saying this about Donald Trump like someone's writing off Donald Trump like he's never going to learn you know he's who he is and like do you just stop learning when you're 70 like it's 70 that's it it's over there's no more data is getting in there well I don't know I don't mean maybe Donald Trump could have a revelation one day you know maybe Donald Trump could realize that

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error of his ways and the way he communicates is you know he's causing more problems and he's fixing ye may be healed be we're not even to point him out because it's just he's just one of us right yeah all of us that I think we're all slowly brutally piecing this thing together and hopefully we're better at it than we were a week ago and hopefully we're better at it than we were six months ago and it's going to continue well that feels like the general tendency in my own life to put out the general tendency in your

► 01:14:18

no no absolutely and you know one of the things that's helped tremendously is this podcast being able to have these long three-hour conversations with people you sit down and talk to them with no distractions it doesn't exist anywhere else doesn't exist in nature someone someone said this to me they said you know you always say on your podcast that you just try to have a conversation because but who the fuck has these kind of conversations we just sit down and stare at each other and talk for hours at a time I'm like yeah you're right I mean it is just a conversation still but your right is that it's sort of an accelerated form of it

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like if you you know you can kind of apply it to everything else if you spend enough time doing it you know you're just you're going to get better at it and you're going to a lot of the podcast is thinking right and it's examining your own behavior and examining the way you interface with other people and I do more of that than I ever had before what do you want to change about yourself just keep going the same way I'm going get better at being nice get better at being honest get better at being loving get me the sounds on Pokey hippies

► 01:15:19

it says what it really is yeah when I want to be nicer to I want to have better relationships with my friends better relationships with my family better relationships with people that I don't even know that I mean I mean I just want to interface with the world in a more positive way I think one of the most important things to realize is all the interactions that we have with each other a dependent upon two individuals or more right but it's you and whoever you encounter yeah and the way you encounter them is going to change the way they behave to you and everybody always wants to

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put it off on the person who behaved a certain way to them and in some ways you're right but in other ways your reaction is completely dependent on your own way of approaching it and your reaction may change the way they react you're completely right like any said like if it lets you know throwing a ball against that brick wall it'll bounce back a certain way but if that became a softer surface or indeed a furry wall to quote one of my own films then it will bounce back in a different way so there's this is another

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that's in the program the necessity for forgiveness but if you if you instead of blaming your past and blaming other people you come to a point of forgiveness this create the sort of the Nexus for change as long as you're like oh that person felt me up when I was a kid or my step dad wasn't a loving figure in my life as long as I hold onto that belief I'm trapped by it right I mean I say I relinquish that now is not happening anymore I'm willing to move forward that's another human being they were doing the best they could say

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suddenly you're liberated in your path changes now Joe when he was saying just then mate about like wanting to help my people do you have any particular projects that are specifically about that obviously this podcast is a tool for education but do you have anything that's specifically like right I'm going to do this thing like I don't know take in martial arts in the communities type stuff no no the only thing you'd be really good at that if I had more time I just don't I don't have enough time to do what I'm already doing you know I mean in terms of like just sheer numbers of

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hours in the day and I think I can't just work because if I just work my work won't be any good I mean you have to live it's one of the most important things about stand-up comedy's you can't just do comedy you have to do other things and this is something that took me a long time to figure out like you can't just like ever see a lot of comics they just start talking about like airline travel and hotel rooms and you're just a life is a life and they can relate to it so that's what they talk about what that to me is a failure of gathering

► 01:17:48

research yes yes I mean it's all its life right but yeah but your life has to I think it in order to have like a continual body of work yeah you can't just constantly talk about airline travel you don't have input you having the bottom very conscious that my thing at the beginning of this was about airline travel and the low level low frequency anxiety I experienced in Airline workers it certainly wasn't a comedic bit but it was cultural analysis and did to a degree reveal that I'm in the middle of a press junket and that's my life at the moment I could just as easily

► 01:18:18

I told you about bees I'm a beekeeper I've got these right do you swim in the river you have a bad experiences you have several sort of one be I'm not keeping one be keep one being that's the only trout one he doesn't work here like be I'm free that's it that's like responsibility to have none 60,000 bees I'm not taking that money or anything like that but it does yeah you're right it's give me a sec what's your stand at your stand-up comedy then what is it currently what are you currently what you're like sections your Beats your voice what I'm doing right now is working towards a new Netflix

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look special that I'm going to do in either March or April I have to figure it out want to do it in Boston and I don't want to do when it's too cold with a 10,000 seat a place in Boston - yeah the Wilbur yeah the will good place yeah it's an awesome little theater because it's really it's 900 seats and its really three 300-seat comedy clubs yeah it's three stacked on top of each other it's a great venue well you know what you'll say so you can do an hour so we have three nights for your see what you got a free 20 minute areas do

► 01:19:18

we'll picture yeah well I saw various if you don't mind me I'm glad that it's difficult to talk about on the podcast because without going into actual best but couldn't tell by the area or I'll tell you about Myra to show you that sort of thing I talked about like when I got heavily involved in politics and I found myself on TV shows and doing rants on telly and getting into Political arguments those are great by the way thank you I love doing those love the one you did was itfox news that you did one with it will ya breaking down like what are we doing here I love doing that I like that because there's a lot of ridicule available once you

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get to announce it so you're stuck you're a fucking runaway train once you start a sentence and you start going you're very fast and powerful and they're like whoa whoa whoa and your there's not a lot of alms or us to interject and they're sitting there they're all you know first of all that little starry-eyed in the first place second of all over the runaway trains happen like and then the rides over five minutes later like tin cans of rolling down the aisle and they're like okay it's a good technique will be a must see there what we were saying about BJJ like that language I don't know

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the other language the language of Comedy it's a language I've worked on so one of my techniques is never create space give them no roommates that's a Jutsu has no space smush see if more take the actual Jiu-Jitsu out of it I'm brilliant at Jiu Jitsu yes just actual physical contact holds a locks and chokes I strategists who shows itself in all forms yeah everything that is true Transcendence to find one universal language one universal myth one mind one Consciousness one love yes no

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no the way broadly and you'll see it in all things all right I'm out to Musashi that was pretty good job Rings just drop that in there Chinese philosophy or something Japanese it's like that ooh that's all right what is he some sort of Master he was a samurai that was he was a ronin he was during the time where you know Samurai has roamed the Earth and got into these one-on-one sword fights and he killed sixty two men and one on one sword fights I said life and a bad motherfucker he wrote an amazing book on strategy and life and one of the

► 01:21:18

that he emphasized in that book is that a real Warrior must be balanced you must be good at Art and calligraphy and poetry can't have any holes in your game you have a balanced person or deliberate survive in these intense moments of Swords flying at your face I had never teach a man to fight he doesn't know how to dance it's quite good in it I mean either a fight so he said piece like that but like uh polite but what I sort of like what I've done is I found things like I'd approach it from a different angle of light pointing out the things are

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I did wrong in my political campaigning where I flawed and fell into my ego I do a good long bit about the birth of my daughter like purely from the perspective of a watching a birth like like I spent a commentary a sports commentary on the baby coming out I don't use the beat The rhythms of sports commentary but just actually describing what happened and what it did to my mind to be present at the birth of my daughter to experience something that's so Divine but so animal tearing flesh roaring and all that stuff but it's like

► 01:22:18

these in the house you know so I did beyond that but in every time I build it up into a point of Divinity II and the cat it with like you know how to sort of mad it looks and the obviously I guess you cross yeah so like I do that so I and the whole show rebirth which I'm doing fun Netflix I believe at some point too is like is about is called rebirth and the point of it is how having the baby is meant I've been reborn to myself but a lot of it's about recognizing the limits because I think I got very narcissistically involved in

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politics the same way and possibly getting narcissistically involved in spirituality right now because I still have this yearning this thing that wants to change you know other people's lives change the world in inverted commas you know but like the comedy comes from recognizing my own flaws within you do do any sort of like really difficult to exercise outside of Jiu-Jitsu dear it ever get involved in you know any like yoga like intense yoga like long periods of time like 90-minute hot yoga classes or running or anything with you

► 01:23:18

really have to push yourself physically not really push a run and I listened to your podcast sometimes and Sam Harris podcast sometimes or whatever and I like I do I do do yoga but not like it's interesting that you specifically say push yourself to the Limit why didn't ask important part I think there's a freeing aspect and pushing boundaries and the physical boundaries because it's exhausting and not just exhausting physically but mentally too because there's a strain on your your body's desire to quit like your minds desire

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to seek comfort and that in pushing past that you find this freedom and you also find a vulnerability in who you are as a person yeah it's very difficult to think greatly of yourself and to be ego statistic when you know that you're so fucking tired you have to put your hands on your knees and your heaving and you know and then you have to keep going and then don't be a pussy come on keep going and so your you don't you realize who you are you feel yourself for who you really are as opposed to like adulation and looking at yourself as this

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this thing that's above it all like you realize the the flaws in your mental process the flaws in your physical abilities and I think it's very humbling yeah right I can see that doing that in a bottlee way would be useful but like I to tell you the truth the trouble for me and I think a lot of addicts is not that like of course there's self-obsession but self-obsession isn't usually about I'm fucking great it's normal I'm worthless that's where he runs mostly from that position but it's also you're thinking about yourself all the time right

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the problem that I think needs to be decoded and I think you're right that it in physical exercise is really really important the level took the level to each other I always feel better is not my like I have to work even to bloody do it I'd rather spend all time all the time thinking or doing something thinking I'm fucking but you know what Cummings it is thinking that's what's confusing about it to people it's thinking but it's thinking in a very different way like there's there's thinking when your body is at rest and you're just using your mind whether there's also a thinking when your mind is trying to manage your body under extreme

► 01:25:18

yes and that is also a mental exercise and that's where people get it wrong people look at people that exercise and especially people that work out really hard and they think of them as Meatheads or is like someone whose base or Primal and uninvolved but I feel like there's a high level of mental Evolution involved in being able to push herself like like I I really admire people that you know like you see like a lot of old people that are like semen yoga class all the time that

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it just never fucking stop they're in there and they don't have extreme physical abilities at all they're not there there's nothing athletic about them they're not strong but they're in there grinding and in doing so you have to I mean it can't possibly be comfortable for them right eye looking at their saggy arms and their old legs this is not like some graceful person is able to do this easily this is a person who's really struggling and in real struggle like that there is a mental energy that's involved in forcing your body to go

► 01:26:18

he's uncomfortable motions that I think is very freeing yeah I think you're right what you said Is Well about balance and possibly what you're saying is that I'm a person would benefit from more of that I see a guy in the gym once and he said don't stop exercise and he was old he was like in his 70s he goes don't stop exercising don't let your body find out that it's dying I just keep going don't let your body find out it's dying that's great yeah that's pretty cool isn't it so like right yes I but like I think that you know any form of

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of I think that some variety of it I know you do the yoga you do the Brazilian jiu-jitsu you did a run it I think it's very important have different forms of exercise different forms of mental activity different forms of stimulation to live at like because this is what this machine is designed to do and again I returned to the problem of capitalism is it reduces you to your role within an economic system as opposed to why not Gap go for a run do a bit of fishing you wander around shoot Sorrows do whatever it is you are into and spend some time meditating spend some time except

► 01:27:18

sizing spend your time in loving physical combat but the reason you can't see is no fucking time because your job is to stand on the line or in that cheese grater get grated just get your soul ground down yeah that's that's the number-one necessary anymore it's not necessary it certainly isn't necessary enough to justify spending eight hours plus a day five days a week inside some sort of a box and if not while ago you said we are both a speck of dust and Limitless Consciousness and this I agree with to Limitless expansion

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Limitless contraction possible within Consciousness and what you said if that one idea can change the world very quickly and that's why these systems regulate the kind of information that's available and the way that it's transmitted and also the fact that it exists within the same economic model you can't as long as you're making money as long as the money's getting directed in the right way people will let us talk about real radical stuff they're quite comfortable for us to say hey you should break down the system you should evolve all right well that is good conversation was with guy called Peter tatchell either

► 01:28:18

Australian gay rights activist who lives in the UK and he said as like when you're talking like this with this with notice wreck disrespect for the great civil rights heroes in the people have had civil rights struggles but he said in his experience as a gay rights activist he goes in the end they will yield when it's to do with those things race sexuality peoples of no use but when you do you know the system will yield there were no you're right gay marriage of course all right here we go you know we can't fucking have slavery in the end of course these are Monumental human struggles I'm

► 01:28:48

diminishing them because but if you go near people's Financial interests you are fucked my mother he'll get you there you start saying hey why don't we not pay our mortgages hey everyone let's not pay tax then we need to stop using oil right you fucking you're out yeah that's it straight away so it's sort of like this is what's interesting to me like I was like these are the these are the access points these are the points where there is vulnerability I'm not suggesting that we will organize ourselves into a radical crew of the tax avoiders or

► 01:29:18

mortgage renege has or whatever but probably even though you and I are both doing well we're like you said before we're not in that weird you know upper Stratosphere where you're living on the Hamptons and some fucking Hundred Acre ridiculous Seaside Mansion you wear your helicopter and private jet everywhere and you worth a hundred million dollars and that's a weird world that's a weird world that very few people exist in and once they get there they don't want to leave

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if once you start flying private everywhere you don't want to leave once you have a mansion you don't want an apartment you know once you have a Bentley you don't want to you go you know it's like nobody wants to go down you want to keep moving up yeah and it's weird because I just things happened they tend to happen in so if they have an in if you've got that money through entertainment maybe you're still so if you've got some connection to your roots and do your work yeah yeah right and attainment an art maybe you know you're still connected to the source but when it's cycling Tech and finance yeah you got

► 01:30:18

STD interest my friend Jason Segel the brilliant actor goes you know you guys you think all that stuff's about you the Jets and the Billboards and stuff but it's just the symptoms of other people making money out of you it's not about you at all and you're part of a machine you'll be processed to be kicked out it's not a carousel it's a train it will run out of energy in the soon as you're not providing you're out and I was like doing some promo for this book that I'm still trying to subtly occasionally promote in this freewheeling conversation Facebook and like I thought that me man this place didn't

► 01:30:48

exist like 15 years ago web and look at it now it is a monolith these are like these other kingdoms now Google's jackhammers and all these little ideas that were mixed around phones fuck y'all they just release the newest Google pixel to phone I mean they make they make these incredible devices that you can interface into the Google world and they're optimized for their whole system amazing amazing you know I mean David Foster Wallace your great American author in his book Infinite Jest postulated a world where all stadiums were

► 01:31:18

named after brand where countries and regions were named after brand and it's sort of happening it's happening the flags of our nation's are merely a veil over the true corporate interests the British Empire was always about East India trade and all that kind of crap and this country now is just a veil over true power I'm going to the T-Mobile arena in Las Vegas this weekend for the UFC are you the T Mobile ringing mobile Arena that's what it's called now you know sort of at first when they started to name football stadiums in our country you still

► 01:31:48

still remembered the name of what it used to be before sponsorship but we start to forget that it was ever anything else start to forget we were once Warriors we were once connected to the Earth we are gods were once Eagles and Stags now our gods are the T-Mobile Arena take back your freedom is not the Coliseum it's the Sony Center right where is he the Christians are being thrown to the lions at the same Center of 3:00 p.m. yeah wow yeah yeah well I mean you know

► 01:32:18

when people to use T-Mobile I get it but you might use it will just ask me give me a deal oh use it I like what you're saying keep talking limited data it's nice yeah one hey so like I learned an important lesson off you and this was it when I was like after I came on last time you were doing such a very big UFC event in I think Vegas and my mates like from the gym that go to the Genesis Jim what I've already

► 01:32:48

mentioned that they were coming over for a stag do they didn't ask me but also for our listen I could further inveigle myself into this little crew of martial artist by hooking them up with Joe Rogan tickets and I thought yeah I'll do that like every other politician so forth so I text you are Joe Google cut my mates with this thing and you went okay who are these people is important to you I'll took a moment of thought they are important I like him but what's my motivations here they're like it is a good thing I took a moment to reflect on it and for shall I do this

► 01:33:18

come up with tickets you know maybe I'm doing this for the wrong reasons I took a moment of respite or reflected I didn't do it it was a little lesson it was a little lesson because you gave me pause for respite I think you were doing a stand-up show actually and I want to turn they were already had tickets for stand up that's what it was I was like I could see him backstage passes and your answer wasn't an immediate bend over yes of course I'll do what you want mr. brand it was a bit more questioning like well really well who are these guys well at the reason why I asked I always ask is because like sometimes people say look you don't have to do this but they've been

► 01:33:48

bothering me about it it's a guy work with like or people have said hey would you do this it's my best friend I love this guy and then I go okay yeah she give people a little Junction because I kind of sometimes those people are paying us well it's because somebody may be a pain in the ass to you and you might just be giving in line and I didn't know you as well you know some like well you mean limb and I've really admired the way you handled it like you know I said you want to give my number that was the thing and you went no yeah I don't think

► 01:34:18

give me a number it seemed like I might be Overkill he made me look at my own motivations and I suppose that you know anything that like Carl Jung the great Carl Jung the Mystic and one of the pioneers of psychoanalysis said anything that crosses your path that you didn't intend for that is God in inverted commas and opportunity to learn so this is how I try to approach my life now is like my didn't plan for that to happen what's the lesson here what can I learn from this situation so like you know you know I'm sure them guys would have been fantastic although they did later show

► 01:34:48

show me videos of what went on on I think it was a stag do and they were carrying on like idiots calling up and down corridors drunk out of their minds so perhaps it was for the best but are generally I'm sure that nothing would have gone wrong but when I look at my own motivation what are you doing here why do you want to do this you're doing it a little bit because you want to look cool and don't bother doing that then you know that's a little it's a small evolution in the way that I walk the path small Amendment than a line maybe I will ask again yeah actually Joe could you sort these guys out with tickets for this or that but I'll do it with the right motivation

► 01:35:18

in the right connection now this again as I keep saying this journey from unconsciousness the Consciousness is what has been the myth of my own life I think we have to whether or not we're in just Limitless chaos in an ever-expanding Universe without meaning without Point without love you know it maybe that is the way you know that a lot of people see the world that way it's not how I see the world I see there is being meaning and everything poetry and everything Beauty and everything and certainly in my own life I like to find the story what am I meant to learn here what am I minute

► 01:35:48

do here what did I learn from being ahead Ernest what did I learn from being promiscuous but from being a drug addict and it's all seems to make a kind of sense it all seems to be guiding me towards something and that thing does seem to be love service kindness awareness not trying to manipulate people not trying to get shit off people all the time it's a good journey and I feel like it's sad if people don't get to do their own version of that Journey because they're on the cheese grater because they're pursuing

► 01:36:18

some myths some code from their childhood that they're not good enough or that they don't deserve to be happy or they can't achieve anything whatever wrong they're caught on whether it's the wrong of booze or drugs or the root of the rung of staring at social media the whole time or the wrong of hatred of others or the wrong of being caught in bad relationships with crap job for me I think that we can accelerate that Evolution and I think that there are codes that can slip through in the same way that an Amazon can spring up in 15 years and be this great economic monolith new ideas new face

► 01:36:48

wife's new ideologies can slip into the net particularly now we have this access to technology you've slipped past The Gatekeepers you have your own media Empire out of nothing you know and you've limited it because it's to you you know it's all built around you as an individual and your perspective etcetera but that these are there are ways now of getting information out there that excites me yeah and they sure did you know and what we were talking about two about being a hedonist and doing things wrong and fucking up and what can you learn from them I think every time you

► 01:37:18

look something up and every time you do something badly you there's a lesson that you get out of the weird feelings of failure of discontent and those lessons are extremely valuable you know a person who doesn't make mistakes in a person who doesn't do anything wrong they never learned shit you don't learn anything from doing everything perfectly every time it doesn't happen no one no one and the more bold and Brash you are and the more you take chances and the more you put yourself into these weird positions

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even in these like you know I'm sure when you're you were a sex addict and you're in this hedonistic you know Whirlwind experience you're still you're taking in all this data and you're taking all this in the hollow feeling that you had that you didn't like it is what propelled you to your new stage of Consciousness once you emerge from it yeah that's right every so often like because he's like pleasure light and an orgy I mean that's the point of it I mean there's flash everywhere it's fit their brilliant I was no in hold on a minute

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this isn't working what would really really work you know like sometimes the great gift of promiscuity is you get to experience all the intimacy with all of these strangers and it seemed exciting in the type of sexuality that I've always had is more about worship than any kind of domination I adore you I adore you know so it's not about like I want to control you so like but like you know so all these wonderful experiences and encounters but within it this kind of ongoing seem of loneliness unignorable and

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also this is the thing when you get the things your culture tells you you should be doing and you experience them now you know now you know you can stop chasing the carrot because you've had a bite out of it and it's like well mini bullshit like you know not and it's a hard one to learn because anything that's got an orgasm at the end of it you know there's a degree of pleasure to be had but it takes it takes a while to recognize or what this it would be emotional cost on me to spiritual cost on other people the fact is preventing me from becoming a father from becoming a husband from settling from becoming rooted from

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I mean actually whole from becoming a man from becoming connected it takes a while to spot that I think a lot of people don't get the opportunity to break out that pattern I would never have spotted it had a not first being a heroin addict and hold on a minute you're doing that thing again same with Fame and celebrity well toxic well toxic exciting and Brilliant and loads of lovely people in there and I still like you know I might make another film I don't know what happened but like it's because I'd had the template and the experiences of our this is addiction you're expecting this thing to make you

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feel better now what's happened is I am as a baseline disabused of the idea that the material world will give me anything but it will ever fulfill me that I am responsible for my own connection and that my role here is to serve other people and help them it isn't about if my objective in life is what can I do to augment myself to make myself better I don't you know even self-improvement agree with all that that I grew entirely it's brilliant brilliant thing and it's necessary I think but like in order that I may

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I be of service to others rather than because then I'll just look great in this armchair yank the self-improvement is about being better at what fulfills you the most which is almost always establishing community so don't you think then Joe that we could do something that's a bit more explicitly that from that you already have this huge community that around The Joe Rogan Experience is this something in it bother you like that like that like couldn't there be something that wouldn't cost you that much that might be sort of wonderful didn't listen

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does not flow into your world I'm people go you're an influential figure you unusual you have its strong Mount energy being very open to learning and a very open to extreme and any more broad-minded like you know I grieve you not left wing categories right when categories that shit's all gotta go but I think that there's a real opportunity for you have a huge impact on communities they're very neglected young males for example not knowing how to use their bodies young males that are that violence is becoming a problem for there's not that many people

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that are in as powerful position as you to sort of the wrecks them in different ways that's something that you know about is that something that's come into your orbit well you're doing it right now I mean you're doing it right now by communicating in a way that you're going to get to way more people than you're going to do in the physical sense you know by spreading these ideas and communicating online in a podcast and allowing people to download it for free getting into here for your phone and your head and you know you're jogging and you're driving your car

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ah you're getting ideas and way more people's heads and you ever would buy your physically being there physically being there is very retro know like it really is when you can only be there for so many people what you gonna do I mean I could I do comedy shows for a lot of people but I mean physically being there and doing something and organizing some sort of thing that's when you venture into some weird cult thing that's where the cult thing it gets slippery everybody's covered in baby oil and you just fucking trying

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grip nothing right now we're in a jungle now blood everywhere Mass suicides maybe a right jab but I think it's an interesting thing to observe I do think that's right and I do meet a lot of people in England like the go yeah yeah I heard you on Joe Rogan or I listen to Joe Rogan people talk about and it's interesting because it's it's a different like it's accessing information that people would not have always liked being people come for the fight stuff or come for the Entertainer's but then they're getting you know hit with Graham Hancock or some neurologist or whatever that you

► 01:42:48

getting some behavioralist the weather yeah it's a good thing well I think the wide variety of gas is very important to for me personally because otherwise I'd get bored if I only talk to comedians are only talk to MMA fighters or whatever or even only cocteau scientist I'd get bored you know I like I'd like talking to a bunch of different people you know I mean I didn't plan any of this so that the the way that sort of unfair unfolded is been pretty organic to use an overused word hmm

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me please just briefly is there something about the phenomena of Conor McGregor that is unique what is it that is happening what has happened with him what does he mean what does he mean into UFC what happens to him now that post Mayweather fight what is he an example of easiest of an outlier a Pioneer how will he be regarded what does he represent is he an entertainment product is he a great athlete is a combination of all those things what does he mean for the sport of

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FC and what do you think will happen in mixed martial arts and boxing do you think we'll see more of those kind of events while you're never going to see another one like him right because he's a unique person he's literally being himself you're going to see a bunch of people try to mimic that and in a sense he's sort of mimic the people that came before him like the Chael Sonnen xand the Muhammad Ali's and the people that were really good at talking shit the difference is that what Connors been able to do he's the first guy in the

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have see that's been able to do that that's had spectacular results and also showed his real character in losing and then coming back and winning very quickly afterwards at the same guy like the Nate Diaz fight I think that was a very important character exposing fight because he lost a fight he got humbled and then he jumped right back on the horse and then wound up winning and then he comes back and blows Eddie Alvarez out of the water to become the first two division Kang current champion in the sport

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art I think he's a unique guy in a very it's almost like we don't have a word strong enough unique is not really a strong enough word so is founded on ability in a very basic way he's got brilliant ability and ability massive he's incredibly smart and very he's very Innovative in his techniques and his approaches and I think he has phenomenal coaching as well animal movements the yeah fuck is that walk well he's just

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what is that thing that he does with roses are amazing what does it mean does it mean anything blows mummy on loose he's a guy doing it cocking I mean yeah when I come out and stay sometimes it's just an amazing thing to do with the body yeah peacocking is say cocking looks like oh my God this guy fucking out there look at doing he's letting the other guy know that he's so loose he can kind of strut with his arms like rubber bands flying around but I mean he's a combination of a lot of things he has a brilliant team John

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vinod has coached a brilliant coach he's got you know amazing Jiu-Jitsu coaching and striking coaching in his mind he just he understands how to apply these things and his ability to perform under pressure is fantastic he saw that the Mayweather fight I mean even though he lost that fight he hit Mayweather with some pretty good shots and he won the first three rounds against the greatest boxer of all time so now you should ordinary extraordinary mean you can say easily that Mayweather was taking those rounds off and I agree he was

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and you could say that Mayweather was bringing him to deep water because he knew he would exhaust them because you didn't give them enough time to train for it because really only gave him two months was very brilliant on me with his part he knew that he wouldn't be efficient he would Tire all those kinetic big explosive movements that Connor likes to do their very taxing and he knew that he was not going to have the efficiency to go 12 hard rounds with a master defensive fighter like Mayweather Mayweather was right but he didn't want to get hit with that uppercut that he got cracked within the first round he didn't want to like you know Connors move

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movement was very unusual it took Floyd a while to decipher it he we've been way better for him if he just blew Connor out of the water from one round on and just completely outclassed him but he didn't and one of the reasons why he didn't is because Connors an extraordinary person he has greatness see his greatness I mean he didn't get really have the proper opportunity in only being able to prepare for two months and only having this one professional boxing match there was a lot of things stacked against him and yet I feel although he clearly lost

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he performed admirably I don't think it hurts his stock in any way I think it elevates them and I think his next fight in the UFC whoever would will be will be probably the biggest fight in UFC history if they can do it correctly depending upon who it is especially if it's Nate Diaz because Nate Diaz is a huge name and if Nate Diaz and him decide to do it one more time I think that would be the biggest fight ever in the history of the sport because I think Connor has eclipsed the sport largely you know and maybe for now maybe someone else will come along

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long in the next year or two that does it mean look Connor has only been around for a few years I tweeted to him in two thousand thirteen or fourteen I forgot what it was when he had won a big fight in the UK and I said you know congratulations on an amazing performance I really hope to see in the UFC someday that was like four years ago my God most so in four years he's gone from being this unknown fighter that only like the really hardcore Fanatics like myself knew about to him being

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this worldwide phenomenon he's the the biggest combat sport athlete not just of today ever there's no one like him no one like him no one that has the kind of popularity that he has I mean this fucking guy has thousands and thousands of people fly from Ireland to Vegas every time he fights the weigh-ins it seems like you're in Dublin I mean it's fucking crazy man when you look out when I when I interview him at the weigh-ins in the UFC in Vegas you

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ooh look out you see nothing but Irish Flags you see people screaming and cheering and singing Mandalay Bay during the fucking Floyd Mayweather fight which is not even the venue where the fight was being held Mandalay Bay was packed Bumper to Bumper with Irishman walking down the hallway cheering and singing songs in sync it was insane brilliant there's no one like him in the first we have to have the greatness like without the crane is who gives a fuck he's just another person could like I'd any type of shit about van Gogh

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no like you know who gives a fuck if you cut your ear off if you paint into shit throw paint and you've got to be good so he's game is good but then like but like there are often great Geniuses in sport but to have that like you say this foot so that he used like that romantic ideas of Ireland and he's owned irishness that became an important part of his perception but it's obviously resonating in a very very powerful way to have that kind of devotion well Ireland's very important Ireland's a very important part of the

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equation as well because their appreciation and love and support of him is unprecedented mean I've seen Brazilian fans that love Jose Aldo and I've seen Brazilian fans that love Anderson Silva and you know the worshipped by their countrymen but it pales in comparison to the amount of love the Conor McGregor gets I understand then then myth aligns with his myth the myth of the Irish people as being oppressed by British colonialism and half

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fight for their freedom it resonates with what this man represents and perhaps this is always what happens with figures of greatness whether it's within the realm of sport or within the realm of politics temporarily a person's of captures a particular mood a particular energy and this is what I think again is to do with unconsciousness I don't think people are going like a Kant like are aware of these kind of feelings I think it's stimulated on a level that's not about for this is one of things I'm very interested in what lies beyond the rational

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Anil you know what Li xia we can equate we can work out we can just but there seems to be some ingredient even in Conor McGregor that you can't quite pin down yes there's a greatness is a box oh yes the Irish people you know but there's also some flavor is being caught I wonder if you can ever preempt or understand these things I wonder if you can ever drill down but like the sort of the work of Joseph Campbell the work of Carl Jung the work of these people to say are they are unconscious archetypes there are unconscious themes there are stories that are running below the surface patterns coordinates that can be connected to

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some people will notably the profession of Mark in know how to harness these energies if you have enough people feeling then not good enough they will spend money trying to feel better whether it's the purchase of a car or a coffee or whatever it is one of the key ingredient is make people feel not good enough if you can re harness and redirect people's Sexual Energy so that their sexual energy is directed at products and consumerism then you will sell your product but for me it seems like such a shame to waste this food

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forced to waste this knowledge to waste this energy just to turn people into consumers just to turn everything on this planet into a commodity when what we could be doing is using this energy to imagine new worlds to imagine new systems to use our greatness to use our greatness to I don't know Joe love one another to create new tribes I mean I don't know if you boys had a lot of things together I don't it was pretty good rent that coffees really kicked in actually that's okay Minecraft is not no joke man

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I think I could do enough one I think I won't fucking handle it really hundred fifty milligrams our main line this shit I'll pour it in my eye you want another one I do like it yeah James do you have a matter of the one drug problem well yeah that's truck it is tries a drug I mean what were you saying about Connors I think undeniable he's a hero and he dares to be great I mean he dares to be great in a way that very few people do when he stands in front of the opponent and looks at the entire crowd and goes and goes like that and puts his hands up like that I mean

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he literally is like some archetypal fixture yes yes here from the past I mean beautiful yeah I mean what he and he's also doing by doing that he's like he's letting the opponent realize like you're in there with greatness you're in there with someone who's incredibly comfortable in the moment and someone who truly believes that he's great and the results that he's had like you can't deny that they have a factor in his future success and in the way people love them the way knocked out although with one punch to win the title I mean this giant build up over this

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long period of time and then he just fucking starches him with one shot 13 seconds of the fight and the deafening Roar the Irish in that Arena when that happened was it was fucking insane he's like a hero like a mythical creature I suppose the role of the hero is to embody and represent something higher hmm to inspire buyer the crowd to put me ref into those people those fifteen thousand plus people that saw that fight who knows how much energy that gave them

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them to then go forth and pursue their own dreams because that's a big part of what Heroes represent what would a big part of someone who's accomplishing anything spectacular it's not just that people get to watch it and get this thrill of watching this experience but also that you get energized to go and pursue your own ideas yes this is true I agree but I think an integral component of the Mythic figure of the hero is sacrificed yeah I'm not fucking crazy like I'm in no position bloody World judge Conor McGregor and any

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from any angle because people are brave enough to do that is fucking unbelievable but like a but what I've also felt it while it resonates with us when someone is willing to sacrifice themselves is because it temporarily makes us recognize when someone's like willing to die for what they believe in whether that is you know these civil rights leaders met before Malcolm X knew he was gonna die for doing that and he did it anyway Gandhi had a good sense that he was going to die you did it anyway because what he believed in was more important than what

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he was as an individual and I think that when that happened it reminds us our there's something like you say Inspire it puts breath into US it reminds us we have the capacity for greatness and we are not just contained by our body we are these streams of energy in that moment back there is no disconnection between Conor McGregor and that crowd there is a Oneness a purpose in that single punch punching for all of them in that moment the only thing that saddens me is that it is ultimately not maybe not ultimately but at least seemingly housed by an

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no make idea that's the ultimate thing that prisons it like that sort of contains it do not I mean you gotta pay money to go there normally it's a commodified thing Conor McGregor at all that makes people aware of the stakes that are at hand that makes people aware of the magnitude of the event if you can pack 22,000 people into an arena like that it makes people aware of the magnitude of it all if it just happens on a soccer field no one's watching it's not the same thing you'll quite right I'm not criticizing the crowd because all because the crowd is

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portent that's what it's doing it's representing something bigger but I feel like it's a shame and I feel like I say when you take it like we've taken to the Arts because there's more sensitivity it's more cerebral and it's less embodied you know so Kurt Cobain is like someone like you know like someone in The Matrix waking up in their pod he woke up in the pot of what our fuck you know he knew he was a genius he knew that he was connecting with people he knew he was representing something and you know also use mentally ill and a drug addict and he killed himself and a bye

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there is a sort of a comparison there that he knew that he was becoming commodified he was being reduced to a commodity he woke up in the Pod and for our fuck all of these things that are coming from my heart this truth I isolation alienation the kind of things that he was singing about that in itself became a product the machine can handle it the machine can take people talking about that connecting to people's deepest fears of any other inadequacy and worthlessness and it can turn that into a product and selling I think I think you're getting caught

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up and money as always being a negative and I think Connor Connor is actually embraced the money as a part of the narrative and I think you know another person who's done that without bragging about that as Manny Pacquiao and Manny Pacquiao has made hundreds of millions of dollars in the same form has actually used that to spread well throughout the Philippines and hands out money to people and he's famously generous in that regard and I think with Connors done is it's part of his hero mythology is he sitting on a he's sitting on a throne

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on a pile of gold it's really a part of it all he's a king he's a hero now the heart of the story I'm not criticizing him as an individual and saying Conor McGregor craziest the money yes but I think this ties in this money is a part of the story it's not necessarily negative and I don't think it is negative at all but Joe money is literally a symbol it is nothing but that represents something I promise to pay the bearer we believe this is $1.00 been semantics because he can definitely go out and buy a house with that money go

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is real as fuck like he can go out and buy mansions and cars it's real as fuck the idea that it represents like I promise to give you this yes it's a promissory note but it's fucking real you know he has all that he has a hundred million dollars it is a part of the story he is sitting on a throne on a pile of gold he does have a crown is a crown on his fucking neck I mean it's real Angela I'm not like like I don't see Conor McGregor as the terminus

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at this point I think I see this is an opportunity to critique what the culture is telling us and what the culture is doing to us there you know I understand that you know with money you can acquire goods and services but what I'm saying is is that our ultimate system for evaluating worth has become about Commodities instead of perhaps about beauty or about love not like you know I'm not saying that Conor McGregor should give away all his money and start marching around a

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be the new Jesus of Islander that would be fucking fascinating to watch on the fold I'm saying that isn't it discuss question is it not a little unfortunate but greatness is ultimately given to us as a product that that is how it is received that's how it's understood is it possible that they will be other ways of demonstrating greatness as he does you know when he's fighting is Kurt Cobain did when he was playing but ultimately the dominant thing the dominant Puppeteer the thing pulling the strings

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is the dollar I don't think it is I think it's a part of the story much like you know your clothes are a part of you know what you look like I don't think it's the dominant thing I think it's a big part of how you sell it like this is going to be the biggest fight ever he's going to make you know x million dollars and the way caught me but Connor uses it as a part of his narrative while he drives around and you know drop-top Bentley and he's you know he's got beautiful watches and suits and say fuck you and pinstriping I mean it's part of what he's

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he's done by by creating this incredible mythology mean I don't think it's necessarily in any way shape or form negative I think it's a part of the story say with hip-hop right this is possibly a similar way of looking at the same idea and this isn't think I know the answer to Genoa mean sure I'm not the kind of work this thing out and I want to teach you it I'm like I'm trying to fucking work out myself so with Hip-Hop Hip-Hop first when it comes out it comes out as is angry Roar no not really DP originally it came out as like a

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I'm A hip-hop Hibbett to the hibbity hip-hop did The Beat Don't Stop about it's a Jolie bit with African by and bar at the beginning and then like it becomes a social his whole yeah sure Sugar Hill and bar and yesterday early hip-hop pioneers and then we go through the sort of the phase of you're right it goes through early part of it jolly and Jonathan I like that's the rap Gangsta rapper Wale like anger of we are going to have a voice Straight Outta Compton amazing and then that in itself

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becomes about like what is the the subsequent mutations of Hip Hop as it becomes sort of claimed by a dominant system it becomes about jewelry bullying particular attitudes and loot do not see what I'm saying that there's it's almost like a trend things get pulled into a certain strand a certain way of being it does but it doesn't have to like it didn't with some guys like the really like here's a perfect example one of the best rappers ever Nas Nas never fell into that Nas remains one of the best

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fist of all time remains brilliant all of his rap has meaning it's creative it's interesting he doesn't fall into all the bullshit and The Bling although he has plenty of money and he has all the trappings he's got this sort of style about him where Amina I believe his father was a jazz musician and he grew up with you know with art in his family and he's an artist first and foremost and although he's a brilliant rapper he's my favorite rapper I think that he's never

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never really fallen into all the bullshit bling Mansions all that stuff like the display of it all I mean he has these things but it's not the primary display when you're talking about Nas like as an artist as addition and because again like I suppose we'll all I'm interested in is how likes of cultural movements start off it seems by saying something that's important and Powerful whether it's Punk or hip-hop like becomes a voice to the disembodied or a way of conveying

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disembodied disenfranchised comes a voice for them or like in a similar thing with punk punk very observably cuz it was relatively short-term movement you know bands like the pistols and The Clash and all this stuff these bands came out of England and the quickly became to of commodified and sold back to people what I'm saying is is like that this could be resolved is I'm now starting to drink the second kind of that caveman coffee and it's getting deep deep in for my mind this is too much for one man it's 544 the toucans I might as well do the DMT now I'm almost

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out there so like I'm what I'm saying is that things start with this original germ greatness Beauty Glory heroism but there's anger and there's an external system though Joe that can turn it into a product and sell it to people and I think that that does strip it of its all of its real value yeah and you're saying I suppose no it doesn't matter doesn't have that can just be the architecture of it or the the Aesthetics of it and I'm saying as long as we have a system that is

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we about making money and turning everything into profit and that's what I'm not saying this about any of the individualized in fact that's the point I'm making he is great now is is great like in the Kurt Cobain great great great great great but ultimately only you great me great we're like please God like Paul but everyone's pulled in the direction of profits of like is a thing you've got a swim through like how is it we become free is there something different that could be done here can something truly glorious be done here like when you succeed describe that moment

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of Vegas temporarily being overwhelmed noise it has been in recent Days by tragedy death and blood but in a glorious Spirit of Ireland and a hero that isn't it unfortunate that that energy can't be literally used to create better worlds better systems Better Lives all that really happens is a load and people make bunch of money and probably and I don't necessarily mean the fucking protagonists you know I mean like people talk a lot about athletes and too much money I don't agree with that one

► 02:04:17

few ways that fucking ordinary working-class people can make a lot of money but there are people at the top of that chain a siphoning significant amount of money I have all of those little Industries you know so but that's why people are responsible for making it happen in the first place I mean you can't leave it up to the athletes to put something like that together you need a Dana why you need a Floyd Mayweather and money The Money Team Productions you need people to promote it you need people to put together a press junket in the world tour and and then you need people to organize the pay-per-view and but end been then the real Ultimate

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ultimate result is the inspiration that all the people that watch it get the inspiration the entertainment and it's completely up to the individual whether or not they pursue greatness or whether they just pursue money hmm and it's a trap if there's trappings in both ways is the trappings of greatness with no money there's the sadness of someone who dies great but penniless and homeless and then there's the guy who just threw it all away from money and never ever realized his full potential which is equally sad but I think the in

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is it like that we are showing a particular aspect of our own conditioning there in believing in the myth of the individual but the individual will always Triumph or if you have greatness you know but like no you did say like the great person that dies penniless you know it's a kind of a shame that we don't create benevolent systems that are helpful to the vulnerable where but you're talking about sport right if you're talking about and every is completely and look there has to be some sort of a support team behind the

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all but it's deplete completely dependent upon the individual if you don't have John Kavanagh you know how to straight Blast Gym you don't have Ido portal and Dylan Dennis and all the different people that train Connor you don't have Connor but if you have all those things it's entirely dependent upon the one individual that takes that knowledge and goes in there and performs that's what's so scary about it and that's what's so rewarding to people that watch it because they know it's so dangerous it's so crazy it's so fraught with Peril to be the one that's

► 02:06:17

so much lies upon yeah the one that the the weight on his shoulders is massive and that's one of the most substantial things and the most impressive things about Conor is the way he handles the weight of the pressure that he goes in there and does this in the the giant big moment that he stands there in front of everybody and throws his arms out like he's the king and then everybody goes fucking crazy about his glorious yes it's nothing to do with money it seems like it does but money is a part of it all it's great

► 02:06:47

witness greatness is the thing the money is a side effect of greatness that shit when he does that I don't mean come on man it's beautiful and now and what did you do okay sadek's I don't ever want Conor McGregor to listen to this and think like and forth and Russell Brand criticizing me if I was a bow his head off like fuck what shoulders on that son of a bitch my point is mostly that left no wonder why knocks people deadly that life it is a bit bigger it's hard to tell from the angle but be exposed Stone Fox people up with that left hand boy Whoa

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this is not a critique of any individual this is my I'm trying to understand how systems work that's what I'm trying to understand and I'm suggesting that there are fairer ways of doing things even then when I'm serious the system doesn't mean jack shit if someone can't rise this guy is different okay it's not the system exists all day long 24 7 365 the system's going on this weekend in Vegas there's going to be two World title fights it's not nearly the amount of attention being paid to the

► 02:07:48

two World title fights this weekend is Conor McGregor pulling his dick out and taking a piss in a punchbowl he could do that on pay-per-view and more people would watch it why because he's done so much in the past as an individual the greatness that he has shown it's more than just money it's more than just the system the system exists it's a matter of one person figuring out the frequency that this system operates on and showing this unbelievable performance inside

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side that system that's the individual and that individual is when you talk about his past when a you know it was it was working as a construction worker or as a plumber or some shit and you know it done some amateur boxing and some MMA fights he was a regular guy you grew up in a working-class neighborhood he wasn't Rich he was at there's nothing substantial about him even his own parents say they never thought that he was going to be this guy he figured out a way through it he wasn't born the king he wasn't some some person who you know what for whatever reason was given

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did with this existence you know he worked his way through it figured it out and once he got to the greatest stage in the world when the pressure was at its highest he's shown like the brightest star in the universe and that's that's what's so exciting about him yes I think he's faithful and fascinating but my question is about commodification fucking money freak your freedom that money haha nothing's happening now hold on but when you say so you take a load EMT right or not the technology take a lot of taken him a few effect taking it

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nine nine times when you have them experiences what does it when you come back from it what is it that you feel about the way that systems are organized do not do you come back from a quite fatalistic like oh yeah that's just the way the world is what you think Alderman it's fucking mental there's so much stuff going on things could be different well I don't think about the way that you think about it don't think about these systems I think you spent a lot of time thinking about the elites and the 1% and the system's I don't I don't think about that stuff

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very much not one maybe I think mostly about what I'm interested in is God and Oneness and I think that greatness is a representation of God I think that what is coming through Conor McGregor or Kurt Cobain or Jimi Hendrix or Dorothy Parker is some kind of beauty that that person is the perfect vessel for that's what iconography is the realization of greatness or the realization of God in inverted commas giving this is the actually her lyrics singing the still playing The Star-Spangled Banner would

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it stock unbelievable here's some some moment that pulls us all together now what my curiosity is about DMT is that does DMT make you experience that Oneness or that loss of self in a way that's kind of religious or spiritual what does it do to your hand tense loss of self I mean as intense as any thing but it's in that not even I shouldn't say as if there's no comparison I shouldn't say as intense as anything because there's not a word that I could say that's going to come out of my mouth it's going to do it justice the

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haven't been invented they don't exist because it does all words that we have created they represent things that we can reference in the material world yes yes yes when you when you have a DMT experience you're literally having a conversation with god you're experiencing something that's everything and something that's infinitely powerful and infinitely wise the way I've described it as like you're seeing this insane infinite World of complex geometric patterns that are made out of love and understanding right right

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this you know there's these things in there they might have here right this entity she feels something in there that knows you and I don't know if it's you that knows you it's like you that gets pretty cool your bullshit about them separations dissolve is my is my my suspicion is that there is no separate there is no subject object there is only one that's now you yourself just said is about book starts to feel like it's about loving and Oneness yeah so that level of Consciousness exists so my belief is that our systems whether

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our athletic systems are in a time at systems and certainly our economic political and social systems should be as close to as possible to that feeling that that feeling should be our Guiding Light so I'm not criticizing Conor McGregor the great genius who like I'm fascinated buying a door or Kurt Cobain or anyone I'm just saying isn't it odd that you have personally experienced in your way through DMT and I have through yoga and meditation and Auckland shit I done when I was a kid this sense of Oneness This Love that seems to transcend my

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personal form and everything I Believe In And yet when it comes to our systems for organizing this plane that we live on the material plane the choices we make are not about that love and understanding their about the kind of the about resources and elitism you know so is that I'm not interested in the one percent and all that stuff and a bit interested but what more interested in is why our us our systems not more representative of the Divine pure truth that we can access through spirituality what I think

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systems are based on the monkey need for survival and this sort of it's not good is it we should get beyond that well I think we will but I think it takes a long fucking time just like we were talking about before I mean unless you want to get the world to do DMT tomorrow I mean if we had a DMT day boy that would change a lot of shit I'm very interested in that I mean a very sad like I think that's the role of the role of the shame and the role of the artist I think is to get in the role of the comic even the role of Shame and I mean that's important point that gets that gets distorted there's a lot of people that go down to South America

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because they have this romantic vision of what a shaman is going to do to them and that they're going to go and experience and then they encounter some shyster who really just learned how to make Ayahuasca to prey on Gringos mean that's that's a big big part of the narrative that a lot of people experience when they go down and do that with the wrong people or yeah and that happens may only say because of systems of commodification materialism and profiteering it does but it also it happens because people are just like looking at an opportunity they're opportunistic there

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desperate maybe they've been mistreated maybe they show don't they don't have a particularly you know healthy view of human beings well I reckon is this I'm starting to start to form in in my mind just over the course of this conversation it's like like you said earlier there's the potential for good the potential for bad in all of us sure I see our culture as a magnet and the magnet is pulling out the worst stuff and what I think is it would be possible to have a magnet that was pulling out the best stuff and it has some of the best

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stuff to like what happened in Houston okay they have this giant hurricane that comes down Houston I have put my friend John Dudley went down down there and brought supplies and was feeding people and organized a bunch of other people to help and do the same thing and there was a ton of people that were doing the same ton of people that were donating their time and their money and they were using their boats to help get people out of their homes and there's a video that I saw there was an amazing video these two guys talking after they didn't know each other and there were there were there being interviewed and they were saying that the love that they experienced helping all these people

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pulling them out of the wreckage of this horrible natural disaster that was it was like nothing I'd ever felt that this love was amazing that all these people were being completely altruistic they would being completely generous and just helping and just I think in times of Crisis are you familiar with Sebastian Junger no Sebastian Junger is an amazing War journalist and he wrote a great book called tribe and his his book is essentially all about how

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in beings really only feel at their best in their happiest when they're coming together to overcome something and so that in this in this moment of overcoming this incredible natural disaster that you blame it on Industrial capitalism and global warming blame all that on the fucking the hurricane the end of the day it's a force of nature that no one saw coming no one can there's no one that pulled that trigger right there's a guy in Vegas that pulled that trigger but there's no one that pulled the trigger on that hurricane

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Collective it was it was it was a thing of nature but we got together that is beautiful to cover say agree that anything we're human beings come together like that he's glorious but both of those examples that you using as you yourself alluded to you know you can look at what conditions create hurricane maybe possibly you know we don't know they could have that hurricane has hurricanes have happened forever but that's heavy foods and of have Point as I mean 50 Cent point the other 50% of my point is that that guy Pullin the trigger isn't just an individual here

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is like you said when I was like touching you on the fucking shame and thing they are maybe that shame and had a bad day and that's why I've become a slippery shaming will no doubt a great band liver Shaymin that's like so this got like this so the shooter like of course we all have individual culpability but similarly he is a product of our culture is a product of this again system so like you know there is one form of analysis that says you know there are meteorological disasters that are detached from reality and of course meteorology is its own fucking

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an individual free will there are some neurologists I'm sure you know they say that doesn't even fucking exist that our inner nature our inner meteorology the biochemistry of our system is governing everything but certainly there are connections between each of us that create the way that we behave you know if like if if I haven't experienced in here where I walk out feeling intimidated maybe I'll be less kind people are work with that's a less extreme example of a you know a brutal murders and the more obvious

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this exam we're aware of it we're aware of it which is one of the reasons why altruistic Behavior kind Behavior loving Community these all these things are rewarded because we do understand that those do enforce a better way of people behaving and that real determinism like people like if you if you really truly don't have free will well we know that we would like people to behave Kinder because whatever factors that play into people going out and behaving in a nicer Kinder way

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there are part of that that we know that that's the fuel of that so isn't then the role of us as individuals finding our own Conor McGregor our own greatness our own heroism to create as much as possible a space for that altruism a space for that philanthropy of space for that togetherness to create those moments like you said without hurricane with and like we've all experienced the I know when I do something nice for stuff for other people I started our this is who I'm meant to be this woman to be doing but I in my own personal life get sidetracked by our father

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I've got these economic imperatives I want to fucking feel great about myself because of other people's Applause or you know verification like it like because we are all flawed because we are continually going to battle between the monkey in us the Primal little creature in us and the great Angel within us what if we have an agreement on a social level that what we're aiming towards is the most benevolent the most beautiful and on an individual level we try and do it and communally we encourage each other towards it knowing that we're going to fuck up and fail all the time

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but that we're heading in that direction together instead of what we have which is a system that's about make as much fucking money as you can and get out you're only a hundred years line up the blow jobs that is the system that we have that is capitalist consumerism that's what it's based on this is a machine the machine makes money it's got to have infinite expanse and infinite growth that is that is the system I'm not saying that it's very fatalistic we'll look I don't chase the world you are doing it and you're not you're not living that way so the system will that your

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talking about its escapable you've escaped yes I'm not and we're talking about it and it's just not there's no like Willy Wonka golden ticket that's going to get you out of the system I don't like the way Willy Wonka as far as I could throw him Shady characters fucking Oompa-Loompas where to get them let's think I should be working that's and that's chocolate what's in that truck for that poor boy drowning in there why is Johnny Depp behaving like a young girl man he's with his weird way of talking lot of questions I think it was about Michael Jackson

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I think he was doing my chocolate factory ride a beautiful yeah he's gonna Peter Pan type deal exactly I don't want to throw up yeah come here you I think you to go back to it there he is isn't he beautiful it's Chocolate Factory Johnny look at my wand I think this fatalistic thing that it's just designed to it's I don't think it's designed to do anything I just think it is it is it is and it but it could be an agree with that I even agree with that I think I think that what we live in is the man

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gestation of our most Primal desires greed or not even necessary greed survival and I think that if you extrapolate on that system you end up with what we've got but I think an alternative way of being something that might be a corrective part for us is to look at those thus feelings that you described of the altruism in that hurricane the feeling of greatness in an individual and the way an individual can pull communities together is sort of like a it's not a binary choice I know the world is more complicated than that Joe but like I suppose my quest and indeed fact me my book

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he's about how I individually have got my head and I wrench myself away from selfishness and greed and pride on a daily basis and pull myself toward altruism and love and self-betterment apart of it keep myself fit mentally spiritually so I can be a better part of this excuse me system and perhaps through my self-improvement create better systems because there is all this energy there's all this power and I think it's a shame that it gets siphoned in a particular direction right well that that feeling you express and as you

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express it and express it honestly that resonates with people and I think this what we're talking about is the 49.9% and 50.1% that Rick Strassman was describing it is this constant battle and this is not an easy path I don't think the system operates at the 50-49 level I think the system's way way towards the negative system making cultural system at the economic system human beings and this in this world a capitalist country or where Betsy

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I don't know enough about what goes down in China so I'll say likes of global capitalism say and again I'm not fucking Economist I'm just picking up shit from listening to your podcast and have a podcast I mean that's where I'm getting educated I've luckily turned up at University lately I'm tripping on that fucking coffee man yeah well as sharing deep I gotta have a can I go to the toilet and maybe poo how long have I been in here do you feel like I've done enough about my book which is we've done two hours and 20 minutes we could wrap this you fucking got a clock there you've got his advantages as Buddhas in every direction and we won

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clock I didn't know the time is a clock there there's a clock there there's a front-facing you Rogue yeah the clocks are already seen anybody who's a guest to think about time this is a tune what this fucking kid from England with a dream with a dream I come over here into the lair a dream to sell books I'm just a kid he wants to fuck the system but by my book that's a point out that obviously popular see how dare you point out that

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you see proxy can I do a way to go to another window yeah you got to worry about it man you're good take a leak we're open that door and the first door on the right nah man it's beautiful don't worry about it no no no your good man don't worry you're good told you that caveman coffees gonna get them when were you were gonna pull something about Nas I think you're looking at something I didn't know if you knew he was a venture capitalist

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for whose I mean like I know you opens up restaurants he's opened up that sweet chick Place attentively if his company sells soon I don't know how that happens or if he comes public he could be what they're saying is hip-hop's first true billionaires oh shit Nas net worth is says is only like if that's love your net worth is like 17 million but his that doesn't include all the companies he owns and has been in Brian for a long time no I didn't know about that I knew I knew about his restaurant because friends with Everlasting Everlasting

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goes to that sweet chick I think every last is a piece of that to I don't know maybe doesn't but he took me to it in New York and took me to an LA once we went there but if they were playing music that was so loud it was literally hurting my ears Nas is Like half man half Venture capitalists look at that beautiful suit he's gone he's got a pocket square and like a little small chain if you ever seen the small chain now with the I don't know hmm interesting there's a lot of those motherfuckers make a shit ton of money

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smart why not you know I mean it shows you that they you know they can figure out a way through just their art to get to this weird position where I mean if Nas really does make a billion dollars like fuck still makes amazing music though that's my point my point is that his music never went commercial music fucking fantastic someone was saying I was reading some stuff that he supposedly tried number he had a rap battle up at Beef get a couple beers with Jay-Z with

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Puff Daddy the Hate Me Now thing oh yeah he like he also wrote ghostwrote for Will Smith I don't know that really means you sold out but that's not selling out that's just writing for a friend but the rap battles I think is more just ego thing someone talk shit about him he talked shit about them you know you all right brother all right you got a copy your book you're not fucking around you brought a copy back now you want to show everybody here give it to me I'll hold it up so you don't feel bad haha bugs Anna white Geo whoa

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Logan I'm on The Joe Rogan Experience freedom from our addictions Russell Brand ladies and Gentlemen let's wrap this thing up man we've talked about enough 2 hours and 20 minutes yeah it's good beautiful you kicked it kicked it into the fucking orbit I didn't change the bit that I wrote about use matter of fact because I didn't know you wrote about me in there yeah and now you're fucking interested I'm out I'm feeling good lighted it was slightly what it was I realized I often to put in the word seemingly because I thought that I'd been to reductive

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about you you know me place about like I'm having this experience like where I'm sort of like this is part of the book is about trying to explain how in the addicts mind you're trapped in this constant Cyclone of themself obsessive for and the outside world seems some asset distance in you can't connect to it right so as well as explain now to go for the steps I talk through like this is what it's like to be in my fucking head so I'm like this is me out of my dog and my dog causes all these problems all the time and I run into these people and say all I know like you know

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I ran into them and I start I don't want to go and talk to them to feel self-conscious because they look kind of like cool I think oh no I've got go over and talk to these people I'm going to feel inadequate all I know is how I feel and that's all I'll ever know unless I learn I can learn a new system for being bill this guy comes over and says hello while I stand now on the goose shit we're on this Riverbank vaguely embarrassed by bear my dog Bears looping enthusiasm I heard you on Joe Rogan he says Joe Rogan the former mixed martial artist commentator comedian and host

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if the world's most downloaded podcast is himself an interesting example of new emerging models of masculinity a fusion of right-wing individualism and New Age tolerance a fierce autodidact he has become a champion of American libertarianism and is to me fascinating because he's clever and a good fighter there you go there's me mentioning you in passing now I went over when I rewrote it I said you better put in seemingly because I think I've been a foot without being reductive they're saying me saying right-wing individualism and the road but what do you think about that Joe there you are

► 02:27:13

oh yeah I'm I'm I don't know how much right wing I have in me I'm exactly libertarian and libertarian the right-wing stuff is probably if you talk to a real bright Winger that go to fuck you talking about yeah I think you're right I mean I think like libertarianism would have covered it better but this was written a point where I didn't I hadn't listened to as much stuff so I've changed it this amount you can come in here anytime you want I love talking to you you're awesome if you think so we have a great time we do have a great time that way I'm looking at what's coming back

► 02:27:43

new studio that sounds like your own version of Willy Wonka podcast later I'm gonna be crazy I've heard the thing is you know like this is why I don't take drugs is because I've drunk white or caffeine there and I'm slightly scared of going back to like my normal life you know parachuting back into that but I've got your fucking lying around ladies and gentlemen Joe Rogan go by the book download your podcast what is it called Under the Skin with Russell Brand Under the Skin with Russell Brand goodbye everybody

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thank you ladies and motherfucking gentlemen

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calm forward slash Rogan never worry about losing your shit again

► 02:29:32

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► 02:29:50

and that's it right that's it ladies and gentlemen we did it whoo that was fun thank you for tuning in appreciate the fuck out of you guys I'm having a wonderful time I hope you guys are enjoying this thank you to all our guests and I'm really looking forward to next week Eric Weinstein Brett Brett Weinstein's brother is going to be here the Great and Powerful Christina pazsitzky Tom Segura his wife the co-host of your mom's house she'll be here and one of the

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requested guests ever Paul stamets the mushroom expert guy he's going to be here as well oh good times good times will be had by all and then we're still celebrating fucking Columbus Day it says that shit on my calendar how is that cunt still got a holiday is it called anymore in La it's indigenous people day good we're gonna celebrate indigenous people day on you know what I'm gonna do I'm gonna kill some shit no I already did kill it I'm gonna cook some shit that I killed with a bow

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and arrow to celebrate indigenous people day that's a good way to do it right

► 02:30:56

all right folks were gone it's over thanks everybody I appreciate you to no end and thank you for tuning in with some soup